Re: [asa] ID question?

From: Ted Davis <>
Date: Fri Oct 16 2009 - 09:35:56 EDT

>>> Gregory Arago <> 10/16/2009 7:14 AM >>> writes, among other things:
What are TEs doing other than defending the status quo of 'God uses evolution' here at ASA? This is said to provoke, of course, not to insult. But when I hear Douglas Axe looking in depth at the language of the cell, at the BioLogos (while he employs 'design' language instead), and about other IDists talking about 'information' and 'pattern recognition' - this sounds like 'contemporary' language to me (speaking as a non-natural scientist, involved in the Academy). TE doesn't seem to speak this language as effectively as does ID.


Ted is admittedly annoyed and perplexed--provoked, to borrow Gregory's language. Hold the phone, he says to Gregory.

What are TEs doing? Directing the NIH, for starters. Teaching students at Stanford about Christianity and science for a quarter century (Dick Bube did that). Inventing the maser (Charles Townes) or using lasers to cool atoms (Bill Phillips) and getting the Nobel Prize for it. Writing great books about evolution and Christian faith (John Polkinghorne or Denis Lamoureux or George Murphy or Dennis Alexander). Challenging Richard Dawkins head on (Alister McGrath or Francis Collins or Keith Ward). Directing the ALCATOR plasma physics project at MIT (Ian Hutchinson). Talking about his Roman Catholic faith in biology courses at Brown, and surprising secular students by doing so (Ken Miller). Telling Harvard faculty and students -- as well as anyone else who will invite him to speak on their campuses -- that a scientist can dare to believe in design (Owen Gingerich).

I don't have a lot of time this morning, Gregory, but this is surely sufficient for starters.

This kind of conversation happens all of time, or at least it seems to me that it does. Someone says that TEs don't confront atheism, and when I produce umpteen examples most of them apparently don't "count," since they don't involve questioning the explanatory efficacy of Darwinian evolution. Someone else says that TEs don't believe in a God who really does anything (it's often put that way), and when I produce umpteen examples of TEs who believe in the Incarnation, the bodily resurrection, and the saving power of Jesus I'm ignored (b/c the same thing will be said again the next month by the same person).

Someone else says that TEs are nothing more than "defending the status quo of 'God uses evolution' here at ASA." Well, Gregory, TEs are doing plenty, as I've just shown. If however we take your very narrow view of this, that they are simply "defending the status quo of 'God uses evolution' here at ASA," then let me point out that in this respect TEs are doing nothing more than speaking the truth on this point: they believe that evolution is basically right, they are convinced that the universe is a divine creation, and so they draw the obvious conclusion. If you mean, TEs don't make very much noise, please reread the relevant paragraph above. If you mean, TEs aren't out there challenging the Darwinians about how evolution works, then I have to ask whether you've ever heard of Simon Conway Morris -- who makes as much noise as Bill Dembski or Mike Behe, except with a different instrument.

So, Gregory, what exactly do you mean? Or, have I answered your vacuous claim satisfactorily at this point?


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Received on Fri Oct 16 09:36:14 2009

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