Re: [asa] Youth leaving churches because of old earth

From: David Clounch <>
Date: Wed Aug 05 2009 - 18:36:15 EDT

Under the category "Meat Offered to Idols and Coated in Peanut Butter

Ken Ham also wrote a couple of years ago that ID is like the gay rights

The thing that strikes me is not these sorts of divisions. Rather its what
all groups have in common. "Theism entangled with origins" is a
characteristic of all Christian groups, no matter what their other
differences. Why is there no appreciation on that from folks like Ham? It
took soooooo long for this to sink in for me. Phil Lueck was telling me
years ago about how all forms of origins are in a very generic sense
"creationism" as far as the atheists are concerned. I didn't believe that
at the time. I didn't know what he was talking abut. But its starting to
make sense.

I still think there can be non-theistic options on teleology. I'm not
saying TE has to be wrong. It may turn out to be right. What bothers me is
the intramural warfare between Christian groups. Its hard to tell if Ken
Ham is just frightened or if he truly is arrogant. Ken Ham ought to defend
all of Christianity first, and worry about his dirty laundry family
disagreements with other Christians second. Unfortunately the writings of
the apostle Paul have fallen on deaf ears with him.
(and there's three fingers pointing back at all of us on this one too). ;)
The TE/ID/OEC/YEC argument is a lot like meat offered to idols. Being
picayune over that is what is turning people from Christianity - not any
one particular idea about origins. This is what Chuck Swindoll calls
"peanut butter Christians" in his book The Grace Awakening.

On Wed, Aug 5, 2009 at 2:44 PM, Ted Davis <> wrote:

> You read that subject line correctly. According to Ken Ham (surprise?),
> this is the bottom line reason why young people are leaving churches in
> droves. Amazing. But true -- that is, it's true that Ham thinks this is
> the reason.
> I saw a copy of this book today, browsed it a bit, and that's the bottom
> line for him.
> I guess the youth just don't leave those churches where they're taught the
> YEC view. That's certainly what Ham wants you to think. He's not about to
> admit that his rigidity on this issue is one of the reasons why people won't
> give Christianity a second look -- not those on the inside, but those on the
> outside looking in, who might otherwise go further with their spiritual
> curiosity.
> Ted
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Received on Wed Aug 5 18:36:48 2009

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