Re: [asa] Interview with Denis Lamoureux

From: Merv Bitikofer <>
Date: Mon Jun 08 2009 - 20:55:47 EDT

Murray Hogg wrote:
> I've been playing around doing Wikipedia edits of late, and have
> discovered just how difficult it is to convince evolutionist of the
> scientific materialist sort that Plantinga's Evolutionary Argument
> Against Naturalism is an argument _against Naturalism_ and not an
> argument _against evolution_.
> It seems that they simply can't get over the conviction that an
> argument against naturalism IS an argument against evolution.
> It makes me wonder if the are simply paying lip-service to the idea
> that Theistic Evolution is an even remotely a valid position. After
> all, consistency would seem to demand that they CAN'T allow divine
> guidance/intervention/whatever in a process which theys seem to think
> is naturalistic by definition.
> On those grounds, TE has to be self-referentially incoherent.
> I think I'm beginning to see that it's the unassailable assumption of
> naturalism which leads Dawkins et al to puzzle over how somebody like
> Francis Collins can claim to accept evolution and still believe in
> God. Understanding a bit more about where Dawkins sits I can
> increasingly see why he simply can't get his head around the idea that
> science and Christian belief might be the least bit compatible.
> Blessings,
> Murray
Can you elaborate on the notion of TE being 'self-referentially
incoherent'? I'm on the other side of that wall seeing it from the
perspective of 'how can strong philosophical naturalism possibly be
scientifically coherent?' I would like to be poked on this to see
what it is I'm missing in yours / Dawkins' lines of thought.

I understand that once one allows strong philosophical naturalism into
the definition of evolution that yes ---it would no longer be compatible
with Christianity. But it is precisely over that definition that TEs
would part company with Dawkins. And science is useless to sort out
such definitional disagreements.


To unsubscribe, send a message to with
"unsubscribe asa" (no quotes) as the body of the message.
Received on Mon Jun 8 20:56:18 2009

This archive was generated by hypermail 2.1.8 : Mon Jun 08 2009 - 20:56:18 EDT