Re: [asa] ID and Methodological Naturalism

From: Bill Powers <>
Date: Sat Jun 06 2009 - 15:48:26 EDT

Having spent 25 years doing computational physics of a highly nonlinear
nature, I have often wondered in a like manner regarding the reliability
of such extrapoloated models and the supposed confidence of those who
employ them.

In fact, my experience has been that those with the most confidence are
not the actual developers and users of such codes, but the
administrators who have their hands out.


On Sat, 6 Jun 2009, David Clounch

> Metaphysics is intrinsically a belief system. Government cannot promote
> beliefs.
> Example: Government cannot promote a belief in nationalism. *WEST VIRGINIA
> *
> "Whether the First Amendment to the Constitution will permit officials to
> order observance of ritual of this nature does not depend upon whether as a
> voluntary exercise we would think it to be good, bad or merely innocuous.
> Any credo of nationalism is likely to include what some disapprove or to
> omit what others think essential, and to give off different overtones as it
> takes on different accents or interpretations. If official power exists to
> coerce acceptance of any patriotic creed, what it shall contain cannot be
> decided by courts, but must be largely discretionary with the ordaining
> authority, whose power to prescribe would no doubt include power to amend.
> Hence validity of the asserted power to force an American citizen publicly
> to profess any statement of belief or to engage in any ceremony of assent to
> one, presents questions of power that must be considered independently of
> any idea we may have as to the utility of the ceremony in question.
> Nor does the issue as we see it turn on one's possession of particular
> religious views or the sincerity with which they are held. While religion
> supplies appellees' motive for enduring the discomforts of making the issue
> in this case, many citizens who do not share these religious views hold such
> a compulsory rite to infringe constitutional liberty of the individual. It
> is not necessary to inquire whether non-conformist beliefs will exempt from
> the duty to salute unless we first find power to make the salute a legal
> duty. "
> The question isn't whether one form of metaphysics can be said to work
> better than another. The question is who wields the power to compel an
> individual to recite the belief. Beliefs about origins are intricately
> entangled with and inseparable from beliefs about ultimate destiny. Any
> system of belief that makes claims upon origins and destiny (the ultimate
> and imponderable) must be held neutral.
> Best Regards,
> David Clounch

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Received on Sat Jun 6 15:48:44 2009

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