RE: [asa] fall of Satan logic questions

From: <mrb22667@kansas.net>
Date: Thu May 07 2009 - 11:16:18 EDT

Your point is well taken --and I sympathize with it; but I suppose there is a
third way out of what may be a false dichotomy. And that is to suppose that
there is absolute good, and that God always wills that absolute good -- thus
preserving the possibility of our trying to make sense of it; while at the same
time having faith that God's actions are above question and yet good at the same
time. I know your "dilemma" is common enough to have been given a name among
philosophers or theologians of antiquity, but I can't remember the standard
names given to the options. If I am dodging the challenge, then I'm in pretty
good company, at least --seeing how God answered Job, (or didn't as the case may
be). On second thought, maybe the company I'm really in is that of Job's
friends. Ouch. Sometimes I wonder if only context separates those two views.

At the very least I think the sovereignty side shouldn't be neglected in our
fantasies that we are in charge.

--Merv

Quoting "Dehler, Bernie" <bernie.dehler@intel.com>:

> Merv said:
> "But here's another thought --- how is this for consistency? If you
> create a universe and inhabit it with sentient species, then you get to
> make the rules, call the shots, and even make life & death decisions
> since you are its creator. You aren't the creator of this universe, so
> you don't have that right. Creator is allowed. Created are not. You
> want to play God? Get your own universe. --and good luck."
>
> Your point is that God can do whatever He wants, and whatever He does is
> called "holy" and "good" because it comes from Him. A contrary view is that
> there is absolute good, and God does that because He is good. I like the
> second better- because it is logical and reasonable. God gave us brains, and
> I think He is proud of us when we use them. We can't use our brains if the
> definition of God doesn't derive from logic and common sense... or runs
> contrary to logic. Therefore the "problem of pain" is a decent and honest
> question- the solution is to answer it correctly rather than dodge the
> question.
>
> ...Bernie
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: asa-owner@lists.calvin.edu [mailto:asa-owner@lists.calvin.edu] On
> Behalf Of Merv Bitikofer
> Sent: Thursday, May 07, 2009 3:53 AM
> To: IW; asa
> Subject: Re: [asa] fall of Satan logic questions
>
> IW wrote:
> > Most religious types are anti-abortion. I do not know (though there may
> be)
> > of any religious-conservative Xian groups calling for abortion because God
> > has commanded it. See above.
> >
> > IW
> UNLESS they live in a nation we are at war with and are wearing the
> enemy uniform. --- talk about really, really late term abortions!
>
>
> Sorry ---couldn't resist a rhetorical dig from your local Anabaptist
> trouble maker who is quite aware of the minefield found by us all when
> we try to draw detailed morality imperatives out of Old Testament
> stories. I'm not really looking to rehash all this again though. Nor
> do I mean to make light of the distinction between the innocence of
> infancy and lack of innocence for all of us beyond that. (Though war
> and bombs recognize no such distinctions.) Sorry --I'll stop.
>
>
> But here's another thought --- how is this for consistency? If you
> create a universe and inhabit it with sentient species, then you get to
> make the rules, call the shots, and even make life & death decisions
> since you are its creator. You aren't the creator of this universe, so
> you don't have that right. Creator is allowed. Created are not. You
> want to play God? Get your own universe. --and good luck.
>
>
> --Merv
>
>
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Received on Thu May 7 11:17:03 2009

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