RE: [asa] ID/Miracles/Design

From: Dehler, Bernie <>
Date: Fri Apr 24 2009 - 17:02:05 EDT

Randy said:
"A process such as gene duplication, for example, increases the amount of information in an organism without any external source."

But gene duplication by itself is not adding useful information or resulting in any beneficial improvements.

I think you have to clearly define two things.

 1. Evolution happened, by analyzing the evidence for it (such as genomic comparisons). (Look at all the genomes across plant and animal and compare them- see the history of step-wise development.)
 2. How it happened, no one is completely sure. There are many mechanisms. Random mutation, natural selection, gene duplication are just a subset of all possible mechanisms, many of which remain to be discovered.

But because these mechanisms are a mystery in no way detracts that evolution actually happened. We know it happened because we can trace the footprints of the development of life in the genome. The genome is a giant sandbox in which creations are modified- and all the other left over junk after creating something new is not swept away but there to see. Those are the footprints back to the origin.


From: [] On Behalf Of Randy Isaac
Sent: Thursday, April 23, 2009 10:41 AM
Subject: Re: [asa] ID/Miracles/Design

David Clounch wrote:
"...Behe's point is that traditional evolutionary theory says that the amount and quantity of I increases from A to B. Behe says this is not true, if anything it usually decreases. The argument has always been about information flow. To me it is purely a matter of statistics. If the source of information isn't in the universe then it may come from intelligence (a pre-loaded intelligence), or may even come from outside the universe (again, from an intelligence?). But that doesn't have to mean the source has to be transcendental."

I keep beating this drum over and over but it is important to note that this quote employs a key misunderstanding of the nature of the information in living cells. Information theorists recognize it as configurational information and not intelligence-generated information. There are no mysteries about the source of any increase in information. A process such as gene duplication, for example, increases the amount of information in an organism without any external source. The pattern of information in a living cell is not indicative of any intelligence-initiated information. This misunderstanding is widespread among many ID advocates and it is one of the reasons why ID is not accepted in scientific communities.


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Received on Fri Apr 24 17:03:05 2009

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