RE: [asa] scientific fact vs. ideology?

From: Stephen J. Krogh, P.G. <panterragroup@mindspring.com>
Date: Tue Mar 17 2009 - 23:17:07 EDT

The only computers that I know of that became self aware were in science
fiction movies such as Colossus, the Forbin Project, the Cyberdyne Systems
computer in the Terminator series, or HAL in 2001.
=========================================

> -----Original Message-----
> From: asa-owner@lists.calvin.edu
> [mailto:asa-owner@lists.calvin.edu]On Behalf Of D. F. Siemens, Jr.
> Sent: Tuesday, March 17, 2009 9:52 PM
> To: bernie.dehler@intel.com
> Cc: asa@calvin.edu
> Subject: Re: [asa] scientific fact vs. ideology?
>
>
> There is no "me" in the computer. As I recall, Hawking noted that the
> most advanced computers do not have the intelligence of an earthworm. It
> may be slightly better now, for computers have been improved over the
> decade or so. But there is no cogito with any creature much more advanced
> than an earthworm.
>
> Note that responding to an address is not recognition of existence.
> Dave (ASA)
>
> On Tue, 17 Mar 2009 16:40:16 -0700 "Dehler, Bernie"
> <bernie.dehler@intel.com> writes:
> > "A computer can check an incoming address and determine that it's its
> > call or requires another to respond, but there isn't an "it's me"
> > understanding. The process is "mechanical," not personal."
> >
> > I'm not sure what you mean by that.
> >
> > How does a human understand "me" differently than a computer? They
> > are each both recognizing their own existence.
> >
> > ...Bernie
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: D. F. Siemens, Jr. [mailto:dfsiemensjr@juno.com]
> > Sent: Tuesday, March 17, 2009 3:43 PM
> > To: Dehler, Bernie
> > Cc: asa@calvin.edu
> > Subject: Re: [asa] scientific fact vs. ideology?
> >
> > Self-awareness is implicit in the famous cogito and Augustine's
> > earlier
> > recognition that the most extreme doubter cannot doubt that he
> > exists.
> > One does not have to think deep philosophical thoughts to be
> > self-aware.
> > It's implicit in the tale of the sweet young thing who went into a
> > bank
> > to cash a check. When the teller asked, "Can you identify yourself?"
> > she
> > pulled out a compact, looked in the mirror and declared, "Yes, it's
> > me."
> >
> > A computer can check an incoming address and determine that it's its
> > call
> > or requires another to respond, but there isn't an "it's me"
> > understanding. The process is "mechanical," not personal.
> > Dave (ASA)
> >
> > On Tue, 17 Mar 2009 14:41:26 -0700 "Dehler, Bernie"
> > <bernie.dehler@intel.com> writes:
> > > What is an example of a behavior in humans that shows that one is
> > > 'self aware?' Then we can see if it applies to computers. We can
> >
> > > also see if all humans are 'self aware' by that same example. For
> >
> > > example, if wondering "who am I?" is an example of being 'self
> > > aware,' not all humans are concerned with it, so does that mean
> > they
> > > aren't 'self-aware?'
> > >
> > > ...Bernie
> > >
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Received on Tue Mar 17 23:17:44 2009

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