Re: [asa] Rejoinder 2D from Timaeus: to Dennis Venema

From: D. F. Siemens, Jr. <>
Date: Mon Sep 29 2008 - 17:53:03 EDT

On Mon, 29 Sep 2008 16:20:22 -0500 writes:
> <big snip>
> But to conclude that presently observed natural laws (i.e. planetary
> orbits and
> embryology) may operate on a different set of rules now than in the
> past, that
> is quite another claim. It's a good and bold stroke, and I respect
> it as a
> possible answer to the "knit together in the womb" challenge. But
> while this
> seems to border on (or cross in to) a realm of non-falsifiability,
> I'm sure that
> is just what I.D. people are working on ---finding present evidence
> that
> existing sets of laws are insufficient to explain everything. I see
> that as a
> "burden of proof" load that will crush any side that accepts it;
> hence both
> sides eagerness to make the other carry it. (& their eagerness to
> prematurely
> claim "proof" on what can they can see now.) Possible theme:
> 'Proof' always
> seems to go 'poof'. Such a burden will, I predict, be
> insurmountable in the
> end and leave us ultimately back with faith anyway.
> --Merv
First, the claim that existing laws are insufficient is grossly
inadequate, for what is tacitly advanced is that all future discoveries
will also be inadequate. One should recognize this as hubris.

Second, faith is not what we ultimately return to, but our position at
all times. Science depends on some assumptions that cannot be proved
scientifically. They are a matter of faith, but most of us are radically
committed to them. Additionally, much as I hate it, materialism is a
consistent philosophical position, as is solipsism. There is a faith in
materialism exemplified by some, just as there is a faith in theism.
Sophisticated Christians recognize that they cannot prove this, but they
are totally committed.
Dave (ASA)
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Received on Mon Sep 29 17:58:10 2008

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