Re: [asa] Expelled and ID

From: David Opderbeck <dopderbeck@gmail.com>
Date: Sun Apr 20 2008 - 21:33:30 EDT

Whatever you think if ID, "bad design" is a poor response if you believe in
a creator God at all. However God created, this is we He did, "bad" designs
and all. Unless you profess a God who isn't in control over whatever
procesess He used to create.

On Sun, Apr 20, 2008 at 3:21 PM, skrogh. <panterragroup@mindspring.com>
wrote:

>
> Bad designs haven't seemed to gotten through the ID design detector.
> =========================================
>
> -----Original Message-----
> *From:* asa-owner@lists.calvin.edu [mailto:asa-owner@lists.calvin.edu]*On
> Behalf Of *D. F. Siemens, Jr.
> *Sent:* Saturday, April 19, 2008 10:35 PM
> *To:* panterragroup@mindspring.com
> *Cc:* asa@calvin.edu
> *Subject:* Re: [asa] Expelled and ID
>
> I think there is one which does so in principle. It's opposite would
> justify ID. If we have sequenced the genomes of all the species, or at least
> all the species in one kingdom, and figured out exactly how all the various
> parts work, if we discover some genes/control sequences/whatever else comes
> up that cannot be derived from others earlier in the evolutionary
> development, we presumably have evidence that they were introduced by the
> deity or some superior power. This is sure evidence for ID. However, the
> current indication is that we have sequences in genomes that simply preserve
> stuff from the past, which is clear evidence against ID. Things are too
> sloppy to be designed, unless the designer intends to mislead us.
>
> Generally, given the state of human knowledge, proof and falsification are
> claims too strong to be supported.
> Dave (ASA)
>
> On Sat, 19 Apr 2008 17:46:02 -0500 "skrogh." <panterragroup@mindspring.com>
> writes:
>
> Also, can one conceive of a potential observation that would falsify ID?
>
> -----Original Message-----
> *From:* asa-owner@lists.calvin.edu [mailto:asa-owner@lists.calvin.edu]*On
> Behalf Of *Dehler, Bernie
> *Sent:* Saturday, April 19, 2008 5:39 PM
> *To:* asa@calvin.edu
> *Subject:* RE: [asa] Expelled and ID
>
> ID is saying it is "science" so it can be more serious. To make it
> science, you have to bear on scientific things, such as math (statistics)
> and biology. So they are appealing to the hard sciences to bring it into
> the scientific realm.
>
>
>
> However, they have no scientific hypothesis. "God made it" is not a
> hypothesis, since it can't be tested. By definition, the scientific method
> requires a hypothesis that can be tested. You also can't test evolution per
> "origin of life," but there are other parts of evolution which are testable…
> ID has nothing testable. They think by disproving known naturalistic
> methods, God is then the default answer—but it isn't.
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> *From:* asa-owner@lists.calvin.edu [mailto:asa-owner@lists.calvin.edu] *On
> Behalf Of *Mountainwoman
> *Sent:* Saturday, April 19, 2008 2:10 PM
> *To:* asa@calvin.edu
> *Subject:* [asa] Expelled and ID
>
>
>
> Having just seen Ben Stein's "Expelled," one thought that occurred to me
> is the following:
>
>
>
> Is Intelligent Design a modern incarnation of the classic teleological
> argument for the existence of God and therefore belongs in the philosophy
> and/or theology departments of universities rather than in the science
> departments?
>
>
>
> Paul Bruggink (ASA Member)
>
> Clarington, PA
>
>
>
>

-- 
David W. Opderbeck
Associate Professor of Law
Seton Hall University Law School
Gibbons Institute of Law, Science & Technology
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Received on Sun Apr 20 21:34:38 2008

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