Re: [asa] Evolution, theodicy & trinity

From: Ted Davis <>
Date: Tue Mar 18 2008 - 09:40:10 EDT

>>> Jim Armstrong <> 3/17/2008 8:20 PM >>> asks:

What do you take this "taken up" language to mean?
" Thus the involuntary suffering of all of nature--each species and each
individual creature--must be taken up into the voluntary suffering of
Christ on the cross (theopassionism) and through it the voluntary
suffering of the Father(patripassionism)."
Though the language is poetically appealing, how does that deal with the
problem? It doesn't seem to explain, justify, or undo (redeem) anything.
JimA [Friend of ASA]


Ted responds:


You should join the ASA, to start with. :)

Redemption, Jim, in Russell's view (and also in mine) includes eschatology:
without a life eternally with God, we aren't saved into very much. The NT
keeps talking about how Christ has "all things" under his feet and how he
will redeem "all things." IMO, this is intimately related to salvation.
There is to be a new heaven and earth, probably out of the old one, and in
that kingdom "all things" will have been restored. If the Trinitarian God
has Godself known suffering -- the suffering of "all things," I might point
out -- then IMO this is highly relevant to theodicy. As George MacDonald
wrote, in the passage CS Lewis uses as the epigram for the problem of pain,
"The Son of God suffered unto the death, not that men might not suffer, but
that their sufferings might be like His."

Does this help?


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Received on Tue Mar 18 09:41:44 2008

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