Re: [asa] Tough question for TEs

From: <drsyme@cablespeed.com>
Date: Mon Aug 20 2007 - 15:07:31 EDT

This is an excellent question, and is at the heart of difficulties reconciling some theological doctrines with TE.  And your question raises several questions.

First of all, was Adam an historical figure?  For the sake of argument lets assume that he was although this could be the topic of an entire discussion in and of itself.

Second, while I agree for the most part that the sin of Adam brought about spiritual death, I am not completely sure that the sin of Adam did not bring out physical death as well.  Even though death existed in creation during and prior to the time of Adam it could have been the case that God's intent for mankind was physical immortality, but sin changed that.  I dont know if there is any scriptural references to suggest otherwise, and I think that there is nothing biological that makes physical immortality impossible.  But again this is not the main point of your question.

Your question was about the need for a resurrection.  Why is it necessary?  While Christ was resurrected in the self same body he was crucified in, his body was free from sin, and in that sense Christ not a model for our resurrection.  Our resurrection is necessary, because as Paul indicates in his analogy of the seed, because we die as something corruptible, and temporary, and then are raised into something incorruptible, and immortal



On Mon Aug 20 14:15 , Brent Foster sent:

I ask this because I see questions like this as likely in an upcoming Bible study class on Genesis. Particularly since we just finished one on John!

As a card-carrying TE, I see the fall as a spiritual event. Adam's sin resulted in death. It brought death into the world where there was none before. Spiritual death that is. As Paul said (paraphrased), just as the sin of one man (Adam) brought death into the world, so the ritgheous life of another man (Jesus) brought life back to the world. Spiritual life that is. Physical life was obviously already in the world, just as physical death was already in Adam's world. The curse is spiritual and is on mankind and all the ground that mankind touches. We are all Adam's spiritual offspring when we follow after him by sinning. And we are all Abraham's spiritual offspring when we have faith in Christ. Faith in Christ saves us from the consequences of sin, death. Spiritual death that is. We still suffer physical death. If physical death were a consequence of sin, then Christ's work on the cross is incomplete, because we still suffer the consequence of sin. Some would say the comming !
ressurrection removes this consequence of sin. But all will be ressurrected including unbelievers, as Daniel said, some to everlasting glory and some to everlasting shame and contempt. And ressurrection doesn't erase the fact of death. If it did, it would erase the fact of Jesus' death.

So why is a ressurrection necessary if physical death is not the concequence of sin? Those who see physical death as a consequence of sin see the ressurection as the reversal of the consequences of sin.

I'm no Bible scholar, but in my view of the atonement, it really is necessary to have a real Jesus who really lived a sinnless life and died and suffered separation from God (spiritual death) to pay for our sins. But is the ressurrection necessary for atonement? Is it necessary demonstrate victory over the grave if the grave is not a consequence of sin?

Brent


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To unsubscribe, send a message to majordomo@calvin.edu with "unsubscribe asa" (no quotes) as the body of the message. Received on Mon Aug 20 15:08:06 2007

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