Re: [asa] AIG announcement

From: Michael Roberts <>
Date: Fri Jun 22 2007 - 14:17:53 EDT

Is the paper Snelling did with Mackay the only real geological Paper(?) produced by MacKay who trumpets that he is a geologist and was excommunicated by a Baptist church in Queensland?

  ----- Original Message -----
  From: Steven M Smith
  Sent: Friday, June 22, 2007 6:24 PM
  Subject: Re: [asa] AIG announcement

  Don Nield in his reply to David Campbell wrote:
> If my memory is correct, Ian Plimer in his book "Telling lies for God"
> documented the dichotomy between Snelling's early work on legitimate
> geology using standard dating and his later writings on YEC creation
> science.
> Don

> David Campbell wrote:
>>> "Respected creation scientists" - there's an oxymoron for you!
>>>>> one of the world's most respected creation scientists <<<<
>> It doesn't actually say that he's respected, just that he's more
>> respected than most creation scientists.
>> I think Snelling has actually done some legitimate geology work,
>> though as this indicates that he knows better than what he teaches,
>> it's doubtful whether this earns more respect than someone whose
>> work shows no sign of knowing better.

  AiG has a right to boast here. Andrew Snelling has certainly done respectable science in the fields of uranium mineral deposits, uranium exploration, & stable and radioactive isotopes. Searching the GEOREF bibliographic database, I found 12 references for Snelling (listed as 1-12 below). Certainly during the 1980s, Snelling was regarded as an 'expert' on at least one uranium deposit--the Koongarra deposit in Australia. His publication record is very respectable with 7 articles in well known international journals (pubs. 1, 4, 5, 7, 8, 9, & 10); two articles in Symposium volumes (pubs 2 & 3), and the definitive description of the Koongarra uranium deposit in a major reference work (pub. 11).

  But there are a few oddities in his publication record.

  Oddity #1: There are 2 publications that are stand out by their incongruity (pubs 6 & 12). The first is an extended abstract in 1985 on catastrophic coal deposition (odd subject for an uranium explorationist/isotope researcher) co-authored with John MacKay -- an known Young Earth Creationist (YEC) debater then associated with AiG-Australia -- and the second is the short GSA Abstract for the Steve Austin (Institute for Creation Research) study on nautiloid fossils in the Grand Canyon.

  Oddity #2: Except for the GSA Abstract in 1999, Snelling's publication record in recognized geologic publications ended in 1990. In other words, Snelling has not published any new science in recognized geology publications during the last 16 years. He has, however, been a fairly prolific writer in YEC literature.

  Oddity #3: As Don noted above, several people have seen an odd disconnect in Snelling's publication record. In the 10 non-YEC publications listed below (all except 6 & 12), Snelling recognizes and describes processes that take many thousands or millions of years. For example, in Pub. #1 Snelling writes ...

       "These results can be reconciled by considering that
  the movement of uranium takes place over a time scale
  of tens or hundreds of thousands of years leaving behind
  isotopes such as 230Th, which regenerate 226Ra in the
  location of the original pitchblende." (p. 117, Snelling 1979)

  and in the deposit description in publication #11, Snelling writes ...

       "A 150 Myr period of weathering and erosion followed
  metamorphism. The thick, essentially flat lying Middle
  Proterozoic Kombolgie Formation (primarily sandstones)
  was then deposited unconformably on the Archaean-
  Lower Proterozoic basement and metasediments."
  (p. 807, Snelling 1990)

  Yet during this same period, Andrew Snelling wrote at least 10 articles in YEC literature (primarily the Creation Ex Nihilo magazine). It was this disconnect that caused Alex Ritchie to ask, "Will the Real Dr. Snelling Please Stand Up?" (The Skeptic, Vol. 11, No. 4, pp 12-15; <>)

  Disclaimer: Opinions given herein are my own and are not to be attributed to my employer.


  Andrew Snelling Bibliography from GEOREF

       1) Snelling, A.A., and Dickson, B.L., 1979, Uranium/daughter disequilibrium in the Koongarra uranium deposit, Australia; Mineralium Deposita, vol.14, no.1, pp.109-118.
       2) Dickson, B.L., and Snelling, A.A., 1980, Movements of uranium and daughter isotopes in the Koongarra uranium deposit _in_ Uranium in the Pine Creek Geosyncline; Proceedings of the International uranium symposium on the Pine Creek Geosyncline, Ferguson, John, Goleby, Ann B. (eds.); Collection Comptes Rendus - Agence Internationale de l'Energie Atomique, no.STI/PUB/555, pp.499-507.
       3) Snelling, A.A., 1980, Uraninite and its alteration products, Koongarra uranium deposit _in_ Uranium in the Pine Creek Geosyncline; Proceedings of the International uranium symposium on the Pine Creek Geosyncline, Ferguson, John, Goleby, Ann B. (eds.); Collection Comptes Rendus - Agence Internationale de l'Energie Atomique, no.STI/PUB/555, pp.487-498.
       4) Giblin, A.M., and Snelling, A.A., 1983, Application of hydrogeochemistry to uranium exploration in the Pine Creek Geosyncline, Northern Territory, Australia _in_ Geochemical exploration 1982, Parslow, G.R., (ed.); Journal of Geochemical Exploration, vol.19, no.1-3, pp.33-55.
       5) Snelling, A.A., 1984, A soil geochemistry orientation survey for uranium at Koongarra, Northern Territory _in_ Geochemical exploration in arid and deeply weathered terrains, Davy, R., Mazzucchelli, R.H., (eds.); Journal of Geochemical Exploration, vol.22, no.1-3, pp.83-99.
       6) Snelling, A.A., and MacKay, J.B., 1985, Evidence for catastrophic deposition of coal seams and sediments of the Newcastle Coal Measures _in_ Advances in the study of the Sydney Basin, Moelle, Konrad H.R. (convener); Proceedings of the Symposium, vol.19, pp.110-112.
       7) Dickson, B.L., Gulson, B.L., and Snelling, A.A., 1985, Evaluation of lead isotopic methods for uranium exploration, Koongarra area, Northern Territory, Australia; Journal of Geochemical Exploration, vol.24, no.1, pp.81-102.
       8) Gole, M.J., Butt, C.R.M., and Snelling, A.A., 1986, A groundwater helium survey of the Koongarra uranium deposits, Pine Creek Geosyncline, Northern Territory; Uranium, vol.2, no.4, pp.343-360.
       9) Dickson, B.L., Giblin, A.M., and Snelling, A.A., 1987, The source of radium in anomalous accumulations near sandstone escarpments, Australia; Applied Geochemistry, vol.2, no.4, pp.385-398.
       10) Dickson, B.L., Gulson, B.L., and Snelling, A.A., 1987, Further assessment of stable lead isotope measurements for uranium exploration, Pine Creek Geosyncline, Northern Territory, Australia; Journal of Geochemical Exploration, vol.27, no.1-2, pp.63-75.
       11) Snelling, A.A., 1990, Koongarra uranium deposits _in_ Geology of the mineral deposits of Australia and Papua New Guinea, Hughes, F.E. (ed.); Australasian Institute of Mining and Metallurgy, vol.14, pp.807-812.
       12) Austin, Steven A., Snelling, Andrew A., and Wise, Kurt P., 1999, Canyon-length mass kill of orthocone nautiloids, Redwall Limestone (Mississippian), Grand Canyon, Arizona; Abstracts with Programs - Geological Society of America, vol.31, no.7, pp.421.


  Andrew Snelling Bibliography listed in The Skeptic (<>)

  DOOLAN, ROBERT & ANDREW A SNELLING, 1987. Limestone caves ...a result of Noah's Flood? Creation Ex Nihilo (4), 10-13.
  READ, PETER & ANDREW A SNELLING, 1985. How Old is Australia's Great Barrier Reef? Creation Ex Nihilo. 8(1), 6-9.
  SNELLING, ANDREW A 1982. The Recent Origin of Bass Strait Oil and Gas. Ex Nihilo 5 (2) 43-46.
  SNELLING, ANDREW A 1983. Creationist Geology: The Precambrian. Ex Nihilo 6 (1), 42-46.
  SNELLING, ANDREW A 1983. What about Continental Drift? Have the continents really moved apart? Ex Nihilo 6 (2), 14-16.
  SNELLING, ANDREW A 1984. The recent, rapid formation of the Mt Isa orebodies during Noah's Flood. Ex Nihilo 6 (3) 40-46 (cf. also abstract 17-18).
  SNELLING, ANDREW A 1984. The Origin of Ayers Rock. Creation Ex Nihilo 7 (1).
  SNELLING, ANDREW A 1986. Coal Beds and Noah's Flood. Creation Ex Nihilo 8 (3), 20-21.
  SNELLING, ANDREW A 1989. Is the Sun Shrinking? Creation Ex Nihilo (pt. 1) 11 (1), 14-19. (pt. 2) 11 (2), 30-34. - The Debate Continues. (pt. 3) 11 (3), 40-43 - The Unresolved Question.
  SNELLING, ANDREW A & John Mackay 1984. Coal, Volcanism and Noah's Flood. Ex Nihilo Tech. J. 1, 11-29.


  Steven M. Smith, Geologist, U.S. Geological Survey
  Box 25046, M.S. 973, DFC, Denver, CO 80225
  Office: (303)236-1192, Fax: (303)236-3200
  -USGS Nat'l Geochem. Database NURE HSSR Web Site-

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Received on Fri Jun 22 14:30:07 2007

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