Re: [asa] Altruism and ID

From: Iain Strachan <>
Date: Sat Jun 16 2007 - 06:34:21 EDT

On 6/16/07, PvM <> wrote:
> Iain
> > And since it's my friends who are being dissed by insulting language
> like "Duh" and
> > "scientifically vacuous", then I'm insulted by it as well. It's time to
> give this sort of thing a rest.
> Duh hardly is an insult,

It is very much an insult. The generally accepted source of the expression
(in my country at least) is that it imitates the sound made by someone who
is mentally defective. In other words: "That's obvious, stupid!". Thus (and
I accept you may not have meant it that way), it is ad hominem, and
politically incorrect. As Wayne said, we need to have a good look at the
ugliness within us. Use of such politically incorrect and insulting
language is very much an example of that ugliness, and you should think
again before using such terms.

it's a sound to communicate the obvious. As
> far as 'scientifically vacuous' is concerned, it is a valid
> description of ID, if it is insulting then I apologize for telling the
> truth. We all know the saying though.. the truth...

As is frustratingly all too common, Pim, you duck the issue I was raising!!
The point is that most of us are indeed in the same choir as you - we don't
accept ID as valid. But to those who are sympathetic to ID, to be told
100's of times that their ideas are "scientifically vacuous" isn't going to
convince them ever. It just sounds like a shrill voice in a choir.
Repetition of epithets, even if they are true, isn't going to work at all.
What's needed is reasoned discussion - critical thought. Repeating a slogan
doesn't amount to critical thought.

Please address the point rather than coming out with pointless comments like
"I apologise for telling the truth". What's that supposed to mean? Clearly
you don't apologise for telling the truth, and no-one would expect you to do
so. But telling the truth in a way that advances the argument by discussion
is has to be more productive than repeated assertions of scientific vacuity,
to which IDers will simply repeat that they don't agree with you.


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Received on Sat Jun 16 06:35:04 2007

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