Re: [asa] Papers from colloquium

From: PvM <>
Date: Sun May 13 2007 - 00:25:42 EDT

Remember that ID will never give anything more than a just so story
while science has all the opportunity to provide the data to support
their positive mechanisms.

David Buller asked "Could you expound on the last statement?"

<quote>In other areas more relevant to this group, it seems plausible
that religiosity may have been a side effect of a selective process, a
spandrel of evolution so to speak. As a Christian I find these
findings inspiring as well as in harmony with religious faith.</quote>

The research which indicates that religious beliefs may have an
evolutionary foundation, whether adaptive or as a spandrel, indicate
to me that 1) religious faith is known to all 2) that finding the
religious faith was an outcome of a long path of evolution and hardly
be seen to be trivial 3) religious faith may be unique to humans.

More later...

On 5/12/07, Rich Blinne <> wrote:
> On May 12, 2007, at 6:11 PM, PvM wrote:
> > Good point and we should remember that adaption is but one, though
> > important part, of evolutionary mechanisms.
> > Funny how indeed evolution may had to depend on neutrality to deal
> > with concepts of modularity, robustness and evolvability. But then
> > again, neutrality may very well have been under selective pressures as
> > well.
> That was part of my point but also how it is easy for both sides of
> the ID debate to have "just so" stories. As someone who comes more
> from the physical sciences the additional rigor that population
> genetics gives I find helpful in avoiding the demarcation problem.
> This paper is not really pro-ID. Their point that the other three non-
> adaptive evolutionary mechanisms not having sufficient generative
> ability got thrashed by this paper. The other point in the paper that
> should not be missed by ID is the non-random nature of genetic drift
> even without selection, particularly in the presence of population
> bottlenecks. This point also showed up in the symbiosis paper showing
> how the symbiont genomes because of the inherent bottlenecks drifted
> smaller and smaller. The bottom line that needs to be communicated is
> that the concept of evolution equalling natural selection is a
> cartoon that's a century and a half out of date.

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Received on Sun May 13 00:26:09 2007

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