Re: [asa] Re: ASA stance

From: David Opderbeck <dopderbeck@gmail.com>
Date: Sat May 12 2007 - 20:59:06 EDT

George said: * That could be said in the abstract about the lot of
positions, but at present it's especially YEC that misleads many Christians
& makes Christianity look foolish to scientifically literate people. It
is current & active errors that need to be denounced.*

I don't disagree with you, but I find the line-drawing more
difficult. Should a similar statement be issued concerning OEC progressive
creationists who reject the findings of contemporary science about common
descent? What about sociobiology -- does an a priori rejection of the core
presuppositions of sociobiology based on a prior commitment to a Christian
anthropology strip one of scientific integrity?

One the one hand, it would be good to present a patient, calm, unified
alterative to YEC'ism. OTOH, there are organizations such as Reasons to
Believe that already have that as a primary mission -- albeit from their own
unique perspectives and with their own problematic aspects. Does ASA
primarily want to be an apologetic alteranative to YEC'ism, or does it want
to be a more scholarly forum that will provide alternatives to YECism as a
secondary result of its primary mission?

On 5/12/07, George Murphy <gmurphy@raex.com> wrote:
>
> & since YEC does not "reflect ... commitment to intrgrity in the practice
> of science," it would be quite appropriate for the organization to take a
> stand against it. That could be said in the abstract about the lot of
> positions, but at present it's especially YEC that misleads many Christians
> & makes Christianity look foolish to scientifically literate people. It
> is current & active errors that need to be denounced. Conversely, ASA fails
> in its responsibilities if it does not speak out against such a current
> dangers & contents itself with generalities.
>
> Again - this does not mean that people who personally hold to a young
> earth view have to be "excommunicated" & I don't think they should be.
> Shalom
> George
> http://web.raex.com/~gmurphy/
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> *From:* David Opderbeck <dopderbeck@gmail.com>
> *To:* Alexanian, Moorad <alexanian@uncw.edu>
> *Cc:* Dick Fischer <dickfischer@verizon.net> ; ASA <asa@calvin.edu>
> *Sent:* Saturday, May 12, 2007 6:24 PM
> *Subject:* Re: [asa] Re: ASA stance
>
>
> I tend to agree with Moorad here. The ASA statement of purpose and
> beliefs seems perfectly adequate (http://www.asa3.org/ASA/aboutASA.html
> and http://www.asa3.org/ASA/faithASA.html). There are plenty of
> opportunities to write and speak about whether any particular YEC position
> (or ID position, or TE position, or whatever) reflects both "fidelity to the
> Word of God and a commitment to integrity in the practice of science."
> Let's primarily define ourselves positively, rather than negatively.
>
> On 5/12/07, Alexanian, Moorad <alexanian@uncw.edu> wrote:
> >
> > The basis for ASA membership covers the whole gamut from those
> > interested in science to practicing scientist. It is awarding of fellows
> > that some criteria may be in play. In addition, publishing in PSCF goes
> > through the usual peer-review scrutiny. Therefore, I do not see why a YEC
> > should be banned from ASA. This is essentially, what is written in last page
> > in any issue of PSCF.
> >
> >
> >
> > Moorad
> >
> >
> > ________________________________
> >
> > From: asa-owner@lists.calvin.edu on behalf of Dick Fischer
> > Sent: Sat 5/12/2007 1:14 PM
> > To: ASA
> > Subject: RE: [asa] Re: ASA stance
> >
> >
> >
> > ASA stands for integrity in science. YECs trash science. Why are they
> > welcome? Are non-Christians welcome? Are members of Satanic cults
> > welcome? Muslims? Hindus? Why not just welcome everybody regardless
> > of religious beliefs or attitudes toward science?
> >
> > IDers are and should be welcome. They are theists and respect science
> > even though they have a theory that does not qualify as science.
> >
> > I would be against mentioning YEC at all. Tell everybody what we
> > believe, include earth age and biological evolution too if you like, and
> > those who believe as we do are free to join. Simple.
> >
> > Dick Fischer, Genesis Proclaimed Association
> > Finding Harmony in Bible, Science, and History
> > www.genesisproclaimed.org
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: asa-owner@lists.calvin.edu [mailto: asa-owner@lists.calvin.edu] On
> > Behalf Of Dave Wallace
> > Sent: Saturday, May 12, 2007 8:34 AM
> > Cc: ASA list
> > Subject: [asa] Re: ASA stance
> >
> > Bill Hamilton wrote:
> >
> > >
> > > I would vote for an ASA policy that said essentially
> > >
> > > 1. All ASA members pledge to treat Christian brothers respectfully
> > > 2. YECs are welcome in ASA. However, the ASA accepts the current
> > > geological estimates of the age of the earth and biological evolution
> > > 3. The mission of ASA includes teaching sound science in the Christian
> >
> > > community
> > >
> >
> > As I have thought about it and seen the responses my take is that Bill's
> >
> > suggestion is much better than the one I made namely:
> >
> > <quote>
> > If the issue ever comes up for a vote, probably in the end I would opt
> > for excluding YEC at least from voting membership especially considering
> >
> > that they have formed their own organizations to deal with origins.
> > </quote>
> >
> > UcD does not seem to have been treating TEs at all respectfully IMHO and
> >
> > that is not just in posts but in headline articles that have been
> > affirmed or written by the blog owners.
> >
> >
> > Dave W
> >
> >
> > To unsubscribe, send a message to majordomo@calvin.edu with
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> >
> >
> > To unsubscribe, send a message to majordomo@calvin.edu with
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> >
> >
> >
> >
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> >
>
>

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Received on Sat May 12 20:59:34 2007

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