RE: [asa] Does ASA believe in Adam and Eve?

From: Jon Tandy <>
Date: Fri Mar 30 2007 - 07:41:50 EDT

You said to George, "I believe the author's clear distinction between them
undermines your argument", in which you are referring to the subsidiary
point that the scope of both disasters was equivalent. But then it seems to
me that you went ahead and proved his essential point, which was that the
scope of the "last days judgment" in 2Pet 3:7 is intended to be universal in
You said,
"3. Then he [Peter] asserts that the present heavens and "earth" (land
again, not kosmos) are being reserved for a complete meltdown of the
elements. That is not the same kind of calamity that happened in Noah's
day, it is much greater! The future calamity will destroy the actual earth
-- the very ground beneath us, and not just the people (kosmos) who walk on
I agree with you, this does appear to be included in the intent of Peter's
statement. I don't see how this contradicts George's statement:
"The author counters by pointing to the flood in order to show that "the
heavens and earth" - the whole world - can be destroyed. I do not see how
that language about the coming destruction can reasonably be understood as
less than universal."
The only real difference in your positions on this point seems to be in
whether the elements are "literally" melted, or whether some other literal
fulfillment of a universal judgment, which George has expressed ambivalence
George had written previously: "I agree that "The Bible simply isn't
teaching us exactly what will happen at the final judgment, whether
geographically or otherwise." I am not insisting on the details of fire,
melting of "the elements" (or of what those stoicheia are - there are at
least 4 possibilities). I am simply pointing out the most basic point that
the writer is making - that the promised end is an end for the whole present
order of creation."
For what it's worth,
Jon Tandy

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Received on Fri Mar 30 07:42:11 2007

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