Re: [asa] Does ASA believe in Adam and Eve?

From: David Opderbeck <>
Date: Thu Mar 29 2007 - 12:48:52 EDT

George -- I think you are making the context of Chapter 3 too specific and
literal. The context is simply that judgment will come suddenly. The
example of the flood is a response to the scoffers in verse 3 who say "Where
is this judgment he promised?" These are like the people of Noah's day, who
rebelled against God, not believing God would judge them. The point is
summed up on verse 10: "But the day of the Lord will come like a thief."
The passage has nothing to do with proving that God is powerful enough to
judge the earth -- that is assumed.

I would grant that Peter's language might reflect his Second Temple
presuppositions about what the Genesis texts mean, but I don't think Peter
is teaching anything about those presuppositions in this passage. Moreover,
if you really want to apply the hermeneutic you're endorsing, what would it
mean for Peter to say that the earth will be destroyed at the final judgment
when Peter would have had no idea at all that the Earth is a globe and that
there were people living in what we now call Australia, North America,
etc.? If Peter's Second Temple period presuppositions are being
authoritatively taught in this text, does that mean the Day of the Lord will
affect only the "earth" as it was known to Peter at that time?

I agree that this passage can be interpreted in various ways by folks with
an axe to grind, but I think more often than not the axe is either a YEC
looking for a proof text to support a global flood, or a non-YEC looking to
read the passage just as literally in order to discredit the truthfulness of
the text.

On 3/29/07, George Murphy <> wrote:
> For Jack:
> Not a big assumption. Can anyone without an ax to grind read II Peter
> 3:1-10 & think that "the present heavens and earth" and "the earth and
> everything that is done on it" refers to just a limited part of the earth?
> (That's a rhetorical question.)
> For David:
> Sodom & Gomorrah are given in 2:6 as an example of God's judgment upon
> evil, as is the flood in the preceding verse. In Chapter 3 the flood is
> not spoken of as judgment but as a proof that the world can be brought to
> an end.
> Shalom
> George
> ----- Original Message -----
> *From:* Jack <>
> *To:* George Murphy <> ; Dick Fischer<>;
> ASA <>
> *Sent:* Thursday, March 29, 2007 6:25 AM
> *Subject:* Re: [asa] Does ASA believe in Adam and Eve?
> You are, however, making the assumption that the destruction of the
> "heavens and earth" by fire in II Peter 3:7 is referring to a conflagration
> affecting the whole world.
> ----- Original Message -----
> *From:* David Opderbeck <>
> *To:* George Murphy <>
> *Cc:* Dick Fischer <> ; ASA <>
> *Sent:* Thursday, March 29, 2007 7:03 AM
> *Subject:* Re: [asa] Does ASA believe in Adam and Eve?
> *To note just one point, the way in which II Peter 3:5-7 uses the story of
> the flood to argue for the possibility of the destruction of "the present
> heavens and earth" makes no sense if the writer of II Peter did not think of
> the flood as affecting the whole world. *
> But Peter uses the destruction of Sodom in the very same context in
> chapter 2, which obviously is not global. Petelike Jesus, uses Sodom and
> the flood as types of the final judgment. As types, neither need be
> literally as extensive as the final judgment.

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Received on Thu Mar 29 12:49:14 2007

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