Re: [asa] ELCA Lutheran magazine articles

From: George Murphy <>
Date: Thu Sep 28 2006 - 12:59:18 EDT

Gregory et al -

In connection with your concluding question, note that Hollabuagh's article was accompanied by 2 responses (for which there are links at the beginning of the article). Al Utke's response isn't an endorsement of ID in the sense that the IDers use it (i.e., intelligent design as a necessary component of scientific theories) but does raise some questions about where some concept of intelligent design may be appropriate.

  ----- Original Message -----
  From: Gregory Arago
  To: Austerberry, Charles ;
  Sent: Thursday, September 28, 2006 12:28 PM
  Subject: Re: [asa] ELCA Lutheran magazine articles

  Thank you for pointing to this Lutheran magazine. I enjoyed the articles (and agreed in several cases with the critiques of i+d), but didn't find they help much in sorting out the difficult distinctions between evolution, creation and intelligent design, across a range of fields. They're mainly about the Dover i+d trial and there seems to be a basic consensus already at the ASA discussion list, if not within its membership.

  "As an astronomer, everywhere I look in the universe-from the largest galaxy to the smallest organism-I see evolution. As a Lutheran Christian, I also confess that God created me and all that exists. For me, there is no conflict." - Mark Hollabaugh

  For him, inside of such sweeping statement, there is still evolution and creation, one of the great debates of the 20th century (and second half of the 19th), and today we're in the 21st century! It sure seems easy for physical scientists, or scientists who study physical things to make such professions. Whereas if Dr. Hollabaugh were to speak with someone in his congregation about 'spiritual evolution' or 'evolutionary theology' or suggest that 'God evolves' there'd be quite different implications! What about the things he doesn't 'see' but that still nevertheless exist?

  The French social theorist Michel Foucault wrote: "Look everywhere for power, you will find it [and thus also oppression]."

  Intelligent design advocates/theorists might substitute for this also: "Look everywhere for design, you will find it." (Hasn't someone said this already?)

  Saying 'everywhere I look I see evolution' is just as myopic!!

  These views don't help scientists and they don't help religious persons, even if they are well intentioned testimonies of how science and religion are not in conflict in a person's individual understanding. These three articles seem like 'I told you so's' aimed at anyone who might find something useful in 'intelligent design,' perhaps some courage, even if the theory/methodology itself is dubious.

  Are the articles considered 'good' because they are simply anti-ID?


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Received on Thu Sep 28 13:00:17 2006

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