Re: another heresy?

From: Robert Schneider <>
Date: Sat Dec 10 2005 - 17:09:32 EST

Thank you, Michael, for pointing out that these words occur in a parable.
Jesus is telling the parable, but it is a character in the parable, Father
Abraham, who utters the words in question, to another character in the
story. The latter is the rich man who has failed to honor the Covenant to
help the poor, in this case poor Lazarus (also a character in the parable
and not to be assumed to be the brother of Mary and Martha; different Gospel
anyway; the brother is not mentioned in Luke 10:38-42), and has ignored the
words of the prophets who called his ancestors back to Covenant fidelity.
There is a valuable truth in this parable for Jesus' own hearers and for us
who are believers, but it has nothing to do with Mosaic authorship.

I think I got the forest in the above, most of it anyway. I guess I would
add, consonant with you, that Luke's Gospel presents a post-Resurrection
understanding of the Jesus Luke apparently did not know personally (see
1:1-4) but obviously had come to believe in with all his heart as the one
God has made both Lord and Messiah. Thinking of this Gospel and parable in
terms of a series of concentric circles, we have the author Luke (outer
circle), the Gospel, the narrator of the story told in the Gospel, Jesus the
main character of the story, the parable Jesus tells, the characters in the
parable, and the teachings about Covenant and Kingdom conveyed through the
narrative and dialogue within the parable. Anyone who misses this whole is
still latching on to a tree or two.

I believe this is the sum of what I wish to say about this toipc.

A dear friend will soon be in the bosom of Abraham. I ask your prayers for
Jim, that he may have a peaceful passage to and a joyous judgment before the
Throne of Grace.

Grace and peace,
Bob Schneider

----- Original Message -----
From: "Michael Roberts" <>
To: "Vernon Jenkins" <>; "Robert Schneider"
<>; "Chris Barden" <>
Cc: "ASA list" <>
Sent: Saturday, December 10, 2005 3:15 PM
Subject: Re: another heresy?

>A parable is a parable, no more and no less. In Luke 16 Jesus did not refer
>to Moses as being the author of the Torah, so it is impossible from that to
>conclude he was. It is important to see what the Bible actually says and
>not to force your own opinion on to it. To do that is to twist scripture.
> Remember we listen to Jesus through what is said in the Gospels but Jesus
> did not write the Gospels.
> It's all very simple!
> Michael
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Vernon Jenkins" <>
> To: "Michael Roberts" <>; "Robert
> Schneider" <>; "Chris Barden"
> <>
> Cc: "ASA list" <>
> Sent: Friday, December 09, 2005 11:30 PM
> Subject: Re: another heresy?
>> Michael,
>> Thank you for acting as a spokesman for Bob; but the trouble with this
>> arrangement is that none of my questions get answered - unless you are
>> prepared to have a go, that is.
>> Clearly, Luke 16:19-31 is more than _parable_; it is _revelation_
>> concerning that which interests all believers. And, since it is the Lord
>> himself who says "If they do not listen to Moses and the Prophets, they
>> will not be convinced even if someone rises from the dead." (NIV), why
>> wouldn't it be fair to conclude that he believed Moses to be the author
>> of the Torah? On what possible authority can Bob and yourself claim
>> "Jesus' statement has nothing to do with historical facts about
>> authorship."?
>> Vernon
Received on Sat Dec 10 17:14:25 2005

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