Re: Vatican

From: Charles Carrigan <>
Date: Wed Nov 09 2005 - 23:46:18 EST

So I guess your answer to both of my questions is "no, we cannot agree".
And my questions were completely serious.
So please clarify if I'm misunderstanding - you don't believe Jesus was a man, but rather both a man and woman - ??
Regarding the quoted Jewish scholars - the entire NT states very clearly that many Jewish scholars at the time had gotten many things wrong about what the coming Messiah would be like. What makes you so sure that these particular one's have it right?

Charles W. Carrigan, Ph.D.
Olivet Nazarene University
Dept. of Geology
One University Ave.
Bourbonnais, IL 60914
PH: (815) 939-5346
FX: (815) 939-5071

>>> <> 11/9/2005 10:18 PM >>>

In a message dated 11/9/2005 11:04:09 PM Eastern Standard Time, writes:
Can we at least agree that Jesus of Nazareth was masculine?
and maybe can we also agree that he still is?

Your tongue is surely in your cheek. If you are referring to the wholeness (holiness) of the pre-fall Adam and the new Adam (below) that I get from Scholem and the Nag Hammadi texts, it is in the category of theology/ontology and cannot be confused with a secondary sexual characteristic.
I gave you a great reference. Scholem is considered one of the greatest scholars of Jewish mysticism.
"Jewish theology posits the messiah to be male and female. The reasoning goes this way: Before Eve was created from Adam's rib, Adam contained both male and female principles and therefore had NO DESIRE. Once Adam and Eve were separated, each lacked something the other had and desire was born. It was desire that caused the eating of the apple.
Jesus is portrayed as celibate, like the pre-fall Adam the messiah has no desire. He is complete in himself.
I do not see Christian theology departing from this schema. Also, the nag hammadi texts make much mention of male becoming female and female becoming male to enter the kingdom.
For background see Gershom Scholem's the messianic idea in Judaism"
rich faussette
Received on Wed Nov 9 23:49:42 2005

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