Re: God the interactor (was God the tinkerer)

From: D. F. Siemens, Jr. <dfsiemensjr@juno.com>
Date: Sat Sep 03 2005 - 00:25:41 EDT

Bill,
Your sequence is empirically meaningless as it stands. It is empty. It
could apply to time, or space, or numerical sequence, essentially to
anything that has dimension or something analogous to dimension. If
eternity is without dimension or parts, trying to apply your sequence to
it is impossible. You insist on making God in the image of man. But human
beings were created in the image of God. And Jesus of Nazareth is God's
image in human flesh so that we may know the Father.
Dave

On Fri, 2 Sep 2005 19:37:31 -0700 (PDT) Bill Hamilton
<williamehamiltonjr@yahoo.com> writes:
> Note that the sequence s(k) = f(s(k-1)) doesn't imply anything about
> time. It
> simply says "compute s(k) from s(k-1)". Now perhaps God can see the
> results of
> calculating all the s(k) simultaneously. However, he can still write
>
> s(k)=f(s(k-1)). If he couldn't, we couldn't either.
>
> Dave wrote
>
>
> > The last snt that I recognize is the glorification of the elect. I
> haven't
> > observed this, yet Romans 8 says it has already happened. So it
> both is
> > already and isn't yet.
>
> Well, theologians do use the term "now _and_ not yet" :-).
>
> --- "D. F. Siemens, Jr." <dfsiemensjr@juno.com> wrote:
>
> > Let's see if I understand you guys. If you're right, then there
> was a
> > something-not-time (snt) before God planned the universe, then a
> snt
> > after the original and before the execution when he planned it,
> then a
> > later snt when he produced the universe, followed by many other
> snts. The
> > last snt that I recognize is the glorification of the elect. I
> haven't
> > observed this, yet Romans 8 says it has already happened. So it
> both is
> > already and isn't yet. God, being omnipotent, makes it be and not
> be in
> > some snt.
> >
> > However, I still need clarification. How are snts related to time
> in our
> > universe/experience? Are snts just an aspect of time? How many
> snts
> > occurred during the first period mentioned above? What could have
> gone on
> > during these precursor snts?
> >
> > Why do I get the strong impression that it is not just YECs that
> talk
> > nonsense on the claimed basis of scripture?
> > Dave
> >
> > On Fri, 2 Sep 2005 07:12:28 -0700 (PDT) Bill Hamilton
> > <williamehamiltonjr@yahoo.com> writes:
> > I agree with George. Dave can perhaps be satisfied that in the
> world of
> > logic he is correct. But logic that ignores the constraints
> imposed by
> > knowledge available to us (Scripture) is sterile.
> > Furthermore, Dave's insistence that God cannot engage in a sequence
> of
> > actions limits God. None of us can fully appreciate omnipotence,
> but I
> > would want to be very careful about statements to the effect that
> "God
> > cannot do X".
> >
> > George Murphy <gmurphy@raex.com> wrote:
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "D. F. Siemens, Jr."
> > To:
> > Cc: ;
> > Sent: Wednesday, August 31, 2005 12:13 AM
> > Subject: Re: God the interactor (was God the tinkerer)
> > ......................
> >
> > > Now, if you can come up
> > > with a consistent description of a being both outside of time as
> > Creator
> > > and within time as reactor, apart from the incarnation, I'll
> > acknowledge
> > > a mutable deity.
> > ......................
> >
> > If the qualification "apart from the incarnation" is to be made a
> > condition
> > for the discussion then I have nothing further to say about the
> matter.
> > The
> > Incarnation is the essential reason for talking about God's
> involvement
> > with
> > the time of the world.
> >
> > Shalom
> > George
> > http://web.raex.com/~gmurphy/
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Bill Hamilton
> > William E. Hamilton, Jr., Ph.D.
> > 586.986.1474 (work) 248.652.4148 (home) 248.303.8651 (mobile)
> > "...If God is for us, who is against us?" Rom 8:31
> > __________________________________________________
> > Do You Yahoo!?
> > Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
> > http://mail.yahoo.com
>
>
> Bill Hamilton
> William E. Hamilton, Jr., Ph.D.
> 586.986.1474 (work) 248.652.4148 (home) 248.303.8651 (mobile)
> "...If God is for us, who is against us?" Rom 8:31
>
> __________________________________________________
> Do You Yahoo!?
> Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
> http://mail.yahoo.com
>
>
Received on Sat Sep 3 00:32:24 2005

This archive was generated by hypermail 2.1.8 : Sat Sep 03 2005 - 00:32:24 EDT