Re: How to encourage a former creationist to persevere in faith?

From: D. F. Siemens, Jr. <>
Date: Fri Aug 19 2005 - 23:43:20 EDT

On Fri, 19 Aug 2005 18:15:10 -0700 (PDT) Bill Hamilton
<> writes:
> --- "D. F. Siemens, Jr." <> wrote:
> > By the way, a God who has to tinker to get things right seems to
> fit the
> > notion that the deity is not bright enough to get it right from
> the
> > beginning. But a proper theology has him omnipotent and
> omniscient.
> >
> I agree that God does not _have_ to tinker with things to get them
> right.
> Suppose however, that He _likes_ to tinker, to interact with His
> creation. I
> like Howard Van Till's functional integrity concept very much, but I
> don't
> believe that precludes God from on occasion "getting His hands
> dirty".
> Having said all this, I would add though that the Bible seems to me
> to chiefly
> be a record of God's dealings with men. If He intervenes anywhere,
> it is
> chiefly in the affairs of men.
> Bill Hamilton
> William E. Hamilton, Jr., Ph.D.
> 586.986.1474 (work) 248.652.4148 (home) 248.303.8651 (mobile)
> "...If God is for us, who is against us?" Rom 8:31
I think you've overlooked a problem. If God likes to tinker, then he must
be temporal, and you have to answer such questions as (1) what was god
doing before he created the universe? (2) how could he wait an infinite
length of time before creating the universe, or, otherwise, when did he
begin to be? A rational orthodox theology requires a deity outside of
time. A deity unfolding in time fits process theology and pantheism, not

I must gree with you that the scritptures are primarily a record of God's
dealings with human beings. But I go beyond exegesis to philosophy and
theology, where there are other matters to consider. In theology, I have
to agree with George that it must be staurocentric. But there are also
philosophical issues. And the total package has to be logically
Received on Sat Aug 20 00:34:06 2005

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