RE: The Curse - Upon All Creation or Just Mankind?

From: Mike Tharp <mtharp@exammaster.com>
Date: Wed Sep 22 2004 - 21:03:10 EDT

"Let us not forget that Lucifer fell before man. Doesn't that come into the
picture?"

Good point, Moorad. I hadn't even considered that. However, I don't
believe the fall of Lucifer brought a curse upon the rest of creation.
Nowhere does Scripture seem to indicate this. Not that I'm aware of anyway.
It wasn't until the fall of man that God cursed the ground in Genesis 3:17.

I've also taken another look at Romans 8:22 in light of Jack Syme's
comments. I tend to agree that, within that context, it does not seem to
indicate the entire creation, but "creatures", and even more specifically,
"human creatures". A verse to back this up would be Mark 16:15 where the
word in question, ktisis, is undoubtedly referring to unredeemed humans as
we obviously wouldn't proclaim the gospel to the earth or other animals.
However, the word ktisis is also used in Romans 1:20 to refer to the entire
creation. So I don't think we can be 100% certain what Romans 8:22 is
referring to.

In Christ,
Mike

-----Original Message-----
From: Alexanian, Moorad [mailto:alexanian@uncw.edu]
Sent: Saturday, September 18, 2004 5:21 PM
To: jack syme; Mike Tharp; AmericanScientificAffiliation
Subject: RE: The Curse - Upon All Creation or Just Mankind?

Let us not forget that Lucifer fell before man. Doesn't that come into the
picture?
 
Moorad

________________________________

From: asa-owner@lists.calvin.edu on behalf of jack syme
Sent: Sat 9/18/2004 4:09 PM
To: Mike Tharp; 'AmericanScientificAffiliation'
Subject: Re: The Curse - Upon All Creation or Just Mankind?

 "But if there was
disease and bloodshed prior to the Fall, I don't see how God could call that
"very good". Then again, if there was death and suffering before the fall
and God called it "very good", who am I to argue with him?"

This measurement of "very good" is as subjective a measurement as I can
think of. I look at the universe and the creation, and it seems to me to be
"very good" now, after the fall. Other than mankinds cruelty to other men,
what about the post fall creation do you think is not very good?

Similarly the passage in Romans about the creation groaning? I dont have
the time or resources to go over that now, but preterists interpret
creation, in that passage, as old testament saints. They were waiting for
redemption.
Received on Wed Sep 22 21:22:36 2004

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