Re: Church-State -- some history

From: Howard J. Van Till <hvantill@sbcglobal.net>
Date: Wed May 26 2004 - 20:12:04 EDT

On 5/26/04 2:58 PM, "Innovatia" <dennis@innovatia.com> wrote:

> The real issue for me is whether the government submits itself to the
> authority of Christ or not and governs by biblical law or not.

As I have already indicated, I am just as much opposed to a government that
thinks of itself as specially sanctioned by the God of the Judeo-Christian
Bible as to a government that thinks itself as specially sanctioned by the
God of the Koran. Do you not see the parallel temptations to justify almost
any action by appeal to divine approval or privileged divine blessing (God
is on our side, not yours)? Are not the Crusades of the past or the Islamic
Fundamentalist states of the present sufficient evidence of how the power of
the state is likely to be corrupted by appeal to special divinely sanctioned
privileges and rights?

> No nation-state on earth really does today. All are in rebellion against
> Christ. Consequently, the Enlightenment ideals of fraternity, equality, etc.
> have no stable social base, as is quickly becoming evident in N. America.
> The kingdom to which we belong, though not visibly established yet on earth,
> is our norm for good government and is the standard gainst which the
> existing ones are measured and fall short.

Let me change just a few words: "All nation-states but ours are in
rebellion against Allah. Consequently, the Western ideals of fraternity,
equality, democracy and capitalism have no stable social base, as is quickly
becoming evident in Satanic America. Allah's kingdom to which we belong,
though not visibly established yet on earth, is our norm for good government
and is the true standard against which the existing ones are measured and
fall short." This doesn't sound nearly as convincing when it comes from
another mouth, does it?

> Consequently, it is tempting for
> Christians to settle for a idealistic humanism, but it is possible to opt
> for true biblical government instead, though no real examples currently
> exist. They have in the past, as in the early American colonies, so the
> precedent has been set.
>
> Your points about government abuse are, of course, well taken regarding
> church and state in our setting. But what can one expect in the long run of
> a government in which the highest moral authority is "we the people" and not
> the word of God?

I expect less abuse of power than I see in states that exploit their "right"
to do almost anything in the name of a privileged status relative to God or
Allah.

Howard Van Till
Received on Wed May 26 20:12:26 2004

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