Re: Church-State -- some history

From: Innovatia <>
Date: Sat May 15 2004 - 14:33:55 EDT

----- Original Message -----
From: <>
To: "John W Burgeson" <>; <>
Sent: Thursday, May 13, 2004 9:39 AM
Subject: Re: Church-State -- some history

> Here is something to think about regarding the church
> state issue. IMO we are not serious enough about this
> separation as a society. A perfect example is the recent
> debate regarding same sex marriages.
> What interest does the state have in marriage? It cannot
> and should not be based on relgion, and should be
> restricted to civil issues, like inheritance, taxes, and
> the like.
> ...
> There should be marriage, in a civil sense. Who is
> allowed to do that and what means it takes to do that,
> should be determined by each state. But, it should not
> have any church/religious connection. In other words,
> being married by a priest/pastor/rabbi should have nothing
> to do with it.

This is the logical conclusion that the Constitution leads to, but it is
hardly one a Christian could accept.

Let's strike at the root of this issue. The implications of a humanist
constitution, over time, will yield its humanist fruit through the
legislative process, as Mark Ludwig explains in his books, True Christian
Government and The Christian Revolutionary. ( About two
centuries later, the logical conclusions implied by the Constitution are now
manifesting themselves to the extent where they have provoked the culture

Many Christians suppose they can fight ungodliness on the basis of the U.S.
Constitution instead of on the basis of the Bible and biblical government.
It is no wonder then that the basic fact about the culture wars over the
20th century has been that of defeat after defeat for American Christians,
or at best a tenuous holding on. It is because of the deeper flaw in how the
battle is being fought, which is on the foundations laid by their opponents.

The root alternatives are these: whether Americans will live on the basis
that Jesus
is Lord, which means obeying his commandments, or whether the State is lord,
and we will instead defer our morality to the conclusions that follow from
its laws. Biblical instruction includes civil laws, and one is put in an
either/or situation, especially when they conflict with those of the State.
But even when they do not, the inescapable underlying issue is: who has the
authority to "know" (determine)
good and evil, God or humanity?

The Garden of Eden question is the root church-state question.


Dennis Feucht
Received on Tue May 18 12:26:18 2004

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