From: Hassell, Ian C. (firstname.lastname@example.org)
Date: Tue Jun 17 2003 - 03:40:19 EDT
I agree with your interpretation of Logos - and generally rail against
modern evangelical "bibliolatry" (elevating the word-for-word text of the
Scriptures above an interactive and personal relationship with Jesus Christ
worked through the Holy Spirit). But the problem I keep coming back to is:
Everything we have written about Jesus' life, works, parables and sayings
are recorded in......wouldn't you know it....the Bible. So if it's my
authoritative source for knowing how to be like Him, how can I question it's
authority when there are other passages that I have trouble with?
That's not a rhetorical, but rather an honest question that I still haven't
From: Jim Armstrong [mailto:email@example.com]
Sent: Tuesday, June 17, 2003 5:38 AM
Subject: Re: Bible as truth
I''ll venture to offer a contrary opinion.
Jesus spoke in parables to make sure that the ideas were unmistakably clear.
The problem seems to be that the message is at once too simple and too
challenging to accept as is.
There are no secrets. There's nothing hidden.
It's in Micah 6:8
He has told you, O man, what is good;
And what does the LORD require of you
But to do justice, to love kindness,
And to walk humbly with your God?
and again in Matthew 25:37-40
Then the righteous will answer Him, saying, 'Lord, when did we see You
hungry, and feed You, or thirsty, and give You drink?
'And when did we see You a stranger, and invite You in, or naked, and clothe
'And when did we see You sick, or in prison, and come to You?'
And the King will answer and say to them,
'Truly I say to you, to the extent that you did it to one of these brothers
of Mine, even the least of them, you did it to Me.'
...just in case we missed it in the witness of the life of Jesus.
"Is that all there is to it?" Yes, I think so.
Look at the life of Jesus - what he does and why he does it! Isn't it all
there? Isn't that enough?
It just seems to be so hard to do that it is more comfortable to spend time
and energy in an effort to study, study, study, trying to make more of it
than it is.
To do more - to make it more complicated than the simple charges of the
Micah and Matthew passages - generally seems to serve something in and of
flying in the face of humility of which we are in great need.
Jesus is identified with the Logos. The Bible is not the Logos. Rather it
points to the Logos.
I think that's the intent when John writes, "he that hath seen me hath seen
the Father" (Jn 14:9)
[Keep in mind that John also said, "No man hath seen God at any time," (Jn
so one may surmise that John is not literally saying that looking at Jesus
is the same as looking at God.]
Emulating the life and example of Jesus is challenging enough.
Do we really need anything hard to understand?
Is there anything more worthwhile?
JMHO - oh, did I manage to blow the H part even with this posting? :-)
Debbie Mann wrote:
I feel a little guilt over my last comment. I have tried to listen and
debate the position of the Bible without opinion. However, my heart has an
opinion. I use scriptures throughout every day to help with many aspects of
my day. I am addicted. My head opinion is of course influenced by my heart
My combined opinion (head and heart):
God provides the simple to confound the wise.
Matthew 13:34 All these things spake Jesus unto the multitude in parables;
and without a parable spake he not unto them.
That's a strong statement. The reason is given that He was uttering secrets
that were kept secret since the world began.
Luke 12:2 says that there is nothing hidden that will not be made known.
This theme of the secret or the hidden is more than an evening's Bible
Jesus is The Word. The Bible is The Word. Jesus said nothing to the
multitude that was not in parables.
I think the thesis is pretty clear hear.
The Bible was written for our learning that we might have hope - but it was
not written as a primer with clear, unambiguous information. It was
intentially set up to require faith to peal away the layers of the onions.
Jesus personally explained the meaning, on at least one level, of each of
his parables to his disciples. They didn't get it. Over and over they didn't
get it - and they had full time tutoring for years.
By the way, the Bible sure doesn't teach much that's positive about falling
in love in a romantic sense. Is there one positive story about boy meets
girl, they fall in love and live happily ever after? Jacob and Rebecca is
about the closest I can come up with.
Debbie Mann, PE
Debbie Mann Consulting
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