Re: Evolution

From: George Murphy (
Date: Thu Dec 05 2002 - 23:08:33 EST

  • Next message: "Re: Evolution" wrote:
    > In a message dated 12/5/02 9:05:03 AM Eastern Standard Time,
    > writes:
    > So when Israel recognizes in the story of its ancestor Jacob its own story,
    > it sees that ambiguity - cleverness, the ability to outwit enemies &c, but
    > also the dishonesty to which those traits are easily applied. & in any case,
    > I think that trying to connect this part of the Jacob cycle with the story
    > about his breeding of sheep in order to say something about the intelligence
    > of Ashkenazi Jews is quite forced.
    > Shalom,
    > George
    > rich:
    > You say when Israel recognizes - what is your reference in scripture?
    > george:
    > Israel recognizes it by telling the story of "Israel" as part of its story,
    > part of the inspired witness to God's historical revelation. By repeating
    > this story Israel
    > confesses it to be its own story. That is done, e.g., whenever Israel tells
    > the story of its past as part of its own confession of faith - e.g.,
    > Dt.26:5-10.
    > rich:
    > Who is Israel? You say dishonesty - where is the moral judgment against
    > cunning to which you refer? or is it simply your interpretation?
    > george:
    > Do you consider lying to your blind old father so that you can steal the
    > blessing he intends to give to your brother _honest_?
    > rich:
    > You can characterize my interpretation as forced but my comments were correct
    > regarding the scriptural account and the behavior of today's ashkenazi Jewry,
    > and if not which of my remarks were incorrect? This is extremely important
    > so please be specific.
    > george:
    > If A, B & C are all true, it doesn't follow that A + B => C .
    > rich:
    > I didn't make the connection in the story. The connection is there. Jacob is
    > outraged by Laban's switching of leah for rachel. Jacob retaliates by
    > weakening laban's flocks and strengthening his own. Laban is his kin. What
    > other justification does genesis provide for Jacob's action?
    > george:
    > There is no indication that Jacob's actions to get the flocks of Laban have
    > anything to do with being "outraged" at the switch of Leah for Rachel - that
    > is not
    > mentioned in any of the relevant conversations 30:26-34, 31:4-16, or
    > 31:36-54. Jacob is undoubtedly upset to begin with about getting Leah instead
    > of Rachel,
    > but he gets Rachel anyway after another week (29:27-30). There is no
    > indication that any resentment about Laban's switch played a significant role
    > in the later events. As far as "justification" is concerned, it's simply "He
    > cheated me so I'll get what's coming to me by cheating him." Rather amoral
    > but that's the way people behave.
    > Shalom,
    > George
    > ========================================================================
    > rich's response:
    > But he had to work 7 more years for Rachel, and there are subsequent
    > indications...
    > I maintain that when God predicted 'the elder shall serve the younger' he was
    > referring to the fact that Jacob would come to his older brother's birthright
    > because he was cunning and in this respect God approves of cunning. I also
    > suggested that when Laban gave Leah to Jacob instead of the promised Rachel,
    > Jacob was slighted because his next generation's birthright would go to the
    > sons of a less vivacious, less spirited, less intelligent woman. Would it be
    > more precise biologically to say a less vigorous woman? And that in this
    > respect, Jacob understood the mechanisms of selection and how to breed
    > vigorous sons and that the message of Jacob, stealer of birthrights is that
    > there are no birth 'rights.' Birthright is won by cunning. I conclude
    > intelligence/cunning is favored by God over birthright. The weakening of
    > Laban's flocks is an analogy using the shepherd, the primary Biblical symbol,
    > to illustrate the method one uses to maintain a desired trait (in men,
    > intelligence, in sheep, general vigor) in a population, through good
    > breeding.
    > I add the following evidence which I had never noticed until receiving your
    > response, George. After re-reading Genesis and parts of Exodus I found that
    > the judgment of God is borne out perfectly in the sons of Jacob (see Genesis
    > 49):
    > ===============================
    > The sons of 'dull-eyed' Leah, Jacob's first wife imposed on him by Laban:
    > Reuben, the first born defiles his father's concubine. His father says he
    > will not excel.
    > Simeon and Levi the next two sons of Leah have spades that become weapons of
    > violence. They are cursed by their father.
    > Judah sells Joseph into slavery and marries a Canaanite woman.
    > The son of vivacious Rachel, second wife but the true intended mother of
    > Jacob's first born:
    > Rachel's firstborn, Joseph, who should rightfully have carried the birthright
    > in Jacob's and God's eyes becomes counsel to the Pharoah through his greater
    > intelligence and ruler of his older brothers and so - the elders serve the
    > younger. Jacob's breeding skill with the flocks is reflected in his choice
    > for first wife as manifest in the fate of his sons.
    > ===============================
    > It is precisely the same lesson to be drawn in the story of each generation,
    > Jacob's generation and Joseph's generation. Breed for cunning. Cunning always
    > wins out, even over physical violence. Even when your rightful inheritance is
    > usurped cunning eventually reverses your position.
    > I further suggest that the disparity in IQ between groups of deeply religious
    > Ashkenazi Jews and the general population is the expected result of a
    > 'Darwinian' interpretation of Genesis and an adherence to 'God's Law.' They
    > are breeding their communities for high intelligence which is precisely the
    > viewpoint of Jacob and God as described in Genesis and the judgment of God
    > manifest in the differences between the fates of the sons of Leah and the
    > sons of Rachel.
    > To say that orthodox religious people would be doing anything but what they
    > believe their Scriptures are telling them to do would be the departure from a
    > rational parsimonious approach. The issue is what are the Scriptures saying?
    > Wouldn't we expect to find orthodox behavior reflecting the wisdom of the
    > texts? Above, I have told you what I believe the Scriptures are conveying
    > when you consider the biological information embedded in the texts.
    > Below is some information on Jewish social behaviors:
    > "For 1,500 years Jewish society had been designed to produce intellectuals.
    > ....Jewish society was geared to support them... rich merchants
    >married sages'
    > daughters;... quite suddenly, around the year 1800, this ancient and highly
    > efficient social machine for the production of intellectuals began to shift
    > its output. Instead of pouring all its products into the closed circuit of
    > rabbinical studies;... it unleashed a significant and ever growing proportion
    > of them into secular life. This was an event of shattering importance in
    > world history."
    > A History of the Jews, Paul Johnson, 1988, ppg.s 340-341
    > "Taken together, the data suggest a mean IQ in the 117 range for Ashkenazi
    > Jewish children, with a verbal IQ in the range of 125 and a performance IQ in
    > the average range. These results, if correct, would indicate a difference of
    > almost two standard deviations from the Caucasian mean in verbal IQ - exactly
    > the type of intellectual ability that has been the focus of Jewish education
    > and eugenic practices."
    > A People That shall Dwell Alone, Judaism as a Group Evolutionary Strategy,
    > Kevin MacDonald, p.190
    > =========
    > Breeding for intelligence is in the Bible and some people are still
    > religiously devoted to it.

    1. "Kung fu don't work on a twelve-gauge."
    2. In your analysis of the blessing of Jacob you read in faults of
    Judah which are in
    fact not mentioned in the blessing itself & ignore the fact that he
    is to be the ruler.
    3. Much of your discussion involves reading things into the texts
    that aren't there. I
    have already given a number of examples of this - examples which you
    ignore. I.e., what
    you think the scriptures are conveying is largely what you are
    putting into scripture.
    4. I don't think it profitable to continue this discussion. You may
    conclude if you

    George L. Murphy

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