Genesis Reconsidered, etc.

From: Peter Ruest (
Date: Mon May 20 2002 - 11:53:04 EDT

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    Hello Mike,

    I always enjoy your posts, your biblical perspective, and your careful
    analysis! Your interpretation of Paul's treatment of women's standing in
    the church is interesting. wrote:
    > Hello Peter,
    > Thank you for reposting your recent reply some of Dick Fisher's comments. I
    > somehow missed your post to Dick the first time around. I've printed a copy
    > of it out for future reference, as I have also done with "Genesis
    > Reconsidered."
    > Have you written any other articles which are available on line or for sale
    > in hard copy form?

    Here is a list of some more or less recent articles about creation and
    evolution (if you don't read German, just ignore those):

    Creation and Evolution - Sch–pfung und Evolution

    P. R¸st, "How has life and its diversity been produced", PSCF 44/2 (June
    1992), 80-94;

    P. R¸st, "Die Herkunft des Lebens - Wissen und Glauben" (1994),
    Dokumentation 1/94 (VBG-Verlag, Fr. 7.50), 46 S.

    P. R¸st, "Spezielle und allgemeine Evolutionstheorie" (1998), in: E.
    Gutsche, P.C. H”gele & H. Hafner (Hrsg.), "Zur Diskussion um Sch–pfung
    und Evolution, Gesichtspunkte und Materialien zum Gespr”ch", Porta
    Studien 6 (4. ver”nderte Aufl., SMD Marburg), S. 51-112); P. R¸st, "Spezielle und allgemeine
    Evolutionstheorie" (1998), ...doc (373 kB) oder ...txt (161 kB)

    A. Held & P. R¸st, "Genesis reconsidered", PSCF 51/4 (Dec. 1999),

    P. R¸st, "Das Weltall - auf den Menschen abgestimmt" (2000),
    VBG-Fachaufsatz 1/00 (VBG-Verlag, Fr. 5.-), 32 S.;
    P. R¸st, "Das Weltall - auf den Menschen abgestimmt" (2000) , ...pdf
    (185 kB) , ...doc (597 kB) oder ...txt (97 kB)

    A. Held & P. R¸st, "Taking Genesis as inspired", PSCF 52/3 (Sept. 2000),

    P. R¸st, "Die Entstehung des Lebens und seiner Vielfalt
    -naturwissenschaftliche und theologische Aspekte" (2001), MS 18 S. ("How
    has life and its diversity been produced", ¸bersetzt und erweitert)

    P. R¸st, "Creative providence in biology", PSCF 53/3 (Sept. 2001),
    179-183; + ...
    RustFig1.jpg; ... Ruest.html

    P. R¸st & A. Held, "Genesis und Evolution" (2002), MS 27 S. ("Genesis
    reconsidered", ¸bersetzt und erweitert)

    American Scientific Affiliation (ASA): quarterly publication:
    Perspectives on Science and Christian Faith (PSCF); PSCF articles (since
    1991) available from:

    VBG-Verlag: Publikationen erh”ltlich im VBG-B¸ro, Postfach 2169, CH-8033
    Z¸rich (Preise ohne Versand).

    Institut f¸r Glaube und Wissenschaft (SMD, Postfach 5 54, D-35017
    Marburg): Internet-Dokumente verf¸gbar von: (Textsammlung
    (Download) - Naturwissenschaft).

    > Did you catch my reply to Dick concerning his claim that Genesis 1:27,28
    > cannot be referring to preadamic men because, he says, preadamic men were
    > meat eaters and the people referred to in Gen. 1:27-30 were not? If so, could
    > I get your feedback to what I wrote? If you missed my post on that subject,
    > here is a copy of it.
    > Though this is off the list, please feel free to post your reply to the list
    > if you think it may be of interest to others.
    > Thanks.
    > Mike

    I have read your reply to Dick concerning the meat eating of
    preadamites. Your interpretation looks convincing to me. But I must warn
    you that I don't know Hebrew myself, so, apart from direct use of the
    Hebrew concordance and the Interlinear Hebrew-English, I must rely
    heavily on my dear friend Armin Held for that. I have sent him a copy of
    your reply to Dick, asking for his opinion. So I might come back to your
    question later.


    > My ASA list serve post to Dick Fischer concerning Gen. 1:29,30 and preadamic
    > meat eaters.
    > Hello Dick,
    > Regarding my contention that in Gen. 1:29 God was talking to the first group
    > of men and women He had created, long before he created Adam, you wrote,
    > "Early men were meat eaters. So if God was talking, they weren't listening."
    > I think they were listening very closely. For I have studied the Hebrew of
    > Gen. 1:29,30 and believe it has been mistranslated due to its translators
    > having a strong bias towards a belief that Gen. 1 and Gen. 2 are both
    > describing God's creation of Adam and Eve.
    > We have already discussed verse 29. now let's take a look at verse 30. This
    > verse reads, "And to all the beasts of the earth and all the birds of the air
    > and all the creatures that move on the ground-everything that has the breath
    > of life in it - I give every green plant for food."
    > Why God would have told man what wild animals were allowed to eat? Why would
    > man have had any interest in their diets? After all, man had no control over
    > what they ate. Also, if this translation of verse 29 is correct, then both
    > verses 29 and 30 are scientifically inaccurate. After all, neither mankind
    > nor all creatures in the animal kingdom have ever been strict vegetarians.
    > Anatomically, human beings appear to have been designed by God as omnivores.
    > And many animals clearly appear to have been designed by God as carnivores.
    > Both human and animal physiology seem to stand in clear conflict with Gen.
    > 1:29 and 30, as these verses are commonly translated.
    > With these things in mind, I contend that the Hebrew language in Genesis 1:30
    > has been widely mistranslated, in a way that also greatly affects the meaning
    > of verse 29. I believe these two verses should read as follows:
    > Then God said, "I give you every seed-bearing plant on the face of the whole
    > earth and every tree that has fruit with seed in it. They will be yours for
    > food, and all the beasts of the earth and all the birds of the air and all
    > the creatures that move on the ground-everything that has the breath of life
    > in it - I give, as every green plant, for food." And it was so.
    > This variant translation only involves the removal of one word, "to," at the
    > beginning of verse 30, which does not appear in the Hebrew, and the addition
    > of one word, "as," toward the end of verse 30. Small words like "as" are
    > often added for clarity when biblical Hebrew is translated into English, just
    > as the small word "to" has long been added at the beginning of verse 30.
    > However, these two tiny changes in the translation of verse 30 completely
    > change the meaning of both verses 29 and 30. Instead of telling us that God
    > created mankind and all animal species to be strict vegetarians, they tell us
    > that God created mankind to be omnivores.
    > However, this creates a problem with the traditional understanding of Genesis
    > 9:1-4. If mankind had long eaten both meat and vegetables, why did God tell
    > Noah after the flood that he would from then on be permitted to eat meat,
    > seemingly implying that mankind was not permitted to eat meat previously? I
    > believe the answer to this question can be found in a careful reading of the
    > text. Such a reading reveals that Gen. 9:1-4 may not actually be saying such
    > a thing. The only real change in diet that this verse may actually be
    > describing is one concerning the eating of blood. I believe that before the
    > flood God had allowed Noah and his family to eat meat with "its lifeblood
    > still in it." (vs. 4) But after the flood God required them to bleed their
    > meat before eating it. I believe this new command from God that required the
    > bleeding of meat is the only dietary change referred to in Genesis 9:1-4.
    > If this is true, then why would God have said that, from that time on, all
    > animals would be in fear of Noah and his family? Probably because Noah and
    > his family had, by necessity, been vegetarians for the year they had just
    > spent on the ark, and had during that time made friends with all of the
    > animals on board. Now, however, those same animals which had come to love and
    > trust Noah and his family would come to fear them.
    > As I recall, you pointed out in your book that evidence exists in scripture
    > that people were permitted to eat meat long before the flood. This evidence
    > is found in Gen. 4:4. There we read that, "Abel brought fat portions from
    > some of the firstborn of his flock. The Lord looked with favor on Abel and
    > his offering." The reason God's servants in Old Testament times offered
    > sacrifices to God which included "fat portions" of meat from their flocks is
    > because they wanted to give God their best. And, as most of us know, cuts of
    > meat that are well marbled with fat are considered to be the best cuts of
    > meat. Why? Because they are far more tender and flavorful than lean cuts of
    > meat. How would God's servant Able have known this if he was not a
    >meat eater?
    > I do not believe Adam was a fruitarian. God had only prohibited Adam from
    > eating the fruit of one tree. His doing so did not limit his diet to eating
    > only the fruit on the other trees. God did not prohibit Adam from eating
    > vegetables. Neither did He prohibit him from eating meat. And neither did God
    > prohibit the race of preadamic men and women he spoke to in Gen. 1 from
    > eating meat. In fact, I maintain that He gave them, "all the beasts of the
    > earth and all the birds of the air and all the creatures that move on the
    > ground - everything that has the breath of life in it, as every green plant,
    > for food."
    > Mike

    Dr. Peter Ruest, CH-3148 Lanzenhaeusern, Switzerland
    <> - Biochemistry - Creation and evolution
    "..the work which God created to evolve it" (Genesis 2:3)

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