Re: God acting in creation #4++

From: SteamDoc@aol.com
Date: Sat Dec 15 2001 - 13:36:08 EST

  • Next message: Moorad Alexanian: "Re: Evolution Statement"

    In a message dated 12/15/01 5:28:19 AM Mountain Standard Time,
    RDehaan237@aol.com writes:

    > Let me try this: In my position atoms and molecules are ORGANIZED
    > differently in relation to each other, into more complex arrangements, in a
    > living cell than they were in the prebiotic universe, (for instance, in a
    > star); not that their chemical and physical properties are modified to
    > make
    > living cells. Their RELATIONSHIPS were thus modified, not the inherent
    > chemical properties of the atoms themselves.
    >

    But previously you said that you were *not* invoking miraculous divine
    intervention. Here's an excerpt from an earlier post of yours:

    "I do not accept the implication that my position requires miracles,
    conceptual spinoffs from the resurrection of Jesus. You keep laying miracles
    on my position. Staged creation is adding capabilities to creation, not
    setting aside the laws of nature, or acting outside these laws for redemptive
    purposes, as I see miracles."

    But if God reorganizes the atoms and molecules, modifying the relationships
    into patterns that they were not capable of attaining without God reaching
    in, I don't see any way that can be characterized as anything other than
    miraculous divine intervention. If God puts (maybe for Howard's sake I
    should say "coerces") the molecules into arragements they could not reach
    naturally, that is every bit as much "setting aside the laws of nature" as
    making an axe head float.

    Not that miraculous divine intervention is out of bounds as an explanation
    from a Christian standpoint -- I have no objection to your hypothesizing that
    God worked in such a manner as long as you don't follow Johnson et al. in
    making these particular miraculous interventions a theological necessity. I
    just wish you would go ahead and admit that this is a miraculous
    interventionist position, so that we could move forward and discuss its
    scientific and theological merits rather than trying to pin you down on what
    sort of divine action you envision.

    ---------------------------------------------------------------------
    Dr. Allan H. Harvey, Boulder, Colorado | SteamDoc@aol.com
    "Any opinions expressed here are mine, and should not be
     attributed to my employer, my wife, or my cats"



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