AR: Since this was written by Moses and not by redactors under slavish
influence of the surrounding cultures, I find this ["Gen 7:11, 8:1,2 Against
the Background of Ancient Near Eastern Tradition [Die Welt des Orients 9
(1978) 242-248]. The Ugaritic lines in Aqhat C:1:45, 46 parallel Deut 33:13,
saying of a drought: "No dew. No rain. No welling up of the Deep."]
PS: Since the phraseology in Deut 33:13, "...For the precious things of
heaven, for the dew, And for the deep that coucheth beneath" is very close
to the phraseology in Aqhat, and since Ugaritic and Hebrew are very closely
related languages, and since so many words and phrases in the Hebrew OT are
parallel with and have the same meaning as Ugaritic words and phrases that
they take up two volumes (Ras Shamra Parallels), it is highly probable that
"thm" in Ugaritic meant the same thing as "thm" (tehom) in Hebrew.
As to the Mesopotamian culture, Gen 1-11 is rife with evident ties to
Mesopotamian motifs and traditions. Even your own "colophon theory" is
dependent upon the idea that the "toledoths" in Genesis are based on
cuneiform colophons, that is, Mesopotamian traditions of writing.
The above offers concrete evidence that the meaning of "thm" (tehom) in the
OT can be illuminated by reference to the use of thm in both Ugaritic and
Where is your evidence that although the surrounding cultures had a concept
of the thm as a sea underlying the earth, Moses had a modern concept of the
earth as (1) a globe and (2) with the sea embedded in it and not under it?
AR: The LXX [with its translation of Deut 33:13 as "deeps of fountains"] is
one of the lest reliable translations of the Bible, highly influenced by the
Greek culture and philosophy of the time it was translated.
PS: Because the Torah was highly exalted, the translation of the first five
books was carefully done. And, it should be noted that they followed the
CONTEXT of Deut 33:13. The phrase, "And for the deep that coucheth beneath"
is preceded by a reference to "dew" which time and again is associated in the
OT with agricultural blessing, and is immediately followed by "and for the
precious things of the fruits of the sun" another reference to agricultural
blessing. The "deep that coucheth beneath" is, therefore, _contextually_ a
reference to a source of water that will give agricultural growth and
blessing. It cannot, therefore, be a reference to the Mediterranean, Galilean
or Dead Seas which were not sources of water for agriculture. "the deep that
coucheth beneath" must be a reference to the sea beneath the earth.
AR: This [Ezekiel 31:3, 4 speaking of a cedar tree says, "The waters
it, the deep (Tehom) made it to grow…" This is clearly the ocean beneath the
earth. No one would say of a tree either then or now that "the
or Gallilean sea made it to grow."] is symbolic and metaphoric poetry. One
would hardly expect to find the real meaning of Tehom here.
PS: It is only by understanding the real (literal) meaning of a poetic phrase
that you can grasp the symbolic and metaphoric meaning. "I am the good
Shepherd," 'I am the vine" are symbolic metaphoric statements, but their
meaning is contingent upon the literal meaning of "shepherd" and "vine." You
are rationaliziing away Ezek 31:3, 4.
AR: Deut 8:7, KJV "...a land of brooks of water, of fountains and depths
[tehoms] that spring out of valleys and hills:" This can just as well read
"... of brooks of water, of fountains and rivers/lakes that spring out of
valleys and hills." Tehom can be any deep place, not just seas and oceans.
So, it is very likely a reference to the Jordan river and Galilee and Dead
Seas which it connects.
PS: Again, you ignore the CONTEXT. Deut 8:7 is immediately followed by a
reference to agricultural products, "wheat and barley, and vines and
fig-trees etc." The emphasis on water in 8:7 is because it is such an
important element in producing agricultural products. But, unlike the sources
of water named in the verse, the Jordan river, the Sea of Galilee and the
Dead Sea were not used as sources of water for producing agricultural
products. (See Bible dictionaries on "agriculture" and "irrigation.")
Contextually, the "tehoms" can only refer to fountains fed by the tehom (sea)
beneath the earth.
AR: What was Jesus opinion of the Jewish writings other than the Bible?
Matt15:3, 6, 9 "And why do you break the command of God for the sake of your
tradition? ... Thus you nullify the word of God for the sake of your
tradition. ... They worship me in vain; their teachings are but rules taught
by men." I would not put much faith in the correctness of this Jewish
commentary [Genesis Rabbah, which defines fountains in Gen 8:2 as earthly,
not oceanic fountains] because it is likely influenced by the culture in
which it was written.
PS: Jesus was certainly talking about their views of religion, not the
natural world. He, in fact, credited them with correct understanding of the
natural world (Matt 16:3) Further, my point with Genesis Rabbah was not that
it proves the fountains of Gen 7:11/8:2 were terrrestrial, but that this
interpretation goes back as far as an understanding of these verses can be
traced, whereas your interpretation is a novelty that no one, scholar or
saint, found in the Bible until recent times; and, even now is a rarity.
And, this fact has the clear implication that your interpretation does not
rest upon a straightforward reading of Scripture.
AR: Hasel did not do a study of the use of the word 'fountain' in the Bible
and so his analysis is flawed.
PS: Hasel's whole paper,"The Fountains of the Deep" [Origins (1974)
1(2):67-72] was aimed at interpreting the the meaning of the fountains in Gen
7:11/8:2. And, his conclusion that they referred to everyday terrestrial
fountains fed by subterranean water is not only the historic interpretation
of the Church but the conclusion of virtually every OT scholar in our
time---except within the insular world of creation science. What makes
Hasel's conclusion so relevant is that he believed in a global Flood and
hence had the same bias you have. He would have found that the fountains
were oceanic if the data had not compelled him to say otherwise.
It seems to me you have systematically ignored the biblical context in your
interpretations of the verses of Scripture which show that the fountains of
the great deep were terrrestrial fountains fed by the sea below the earth
(upon which the earth was founded, Ps 24:2); and, you have done this to avoid
having the Word of God falsify your theory. If you really want to follow the
Bible, you need to show contextual evidence for your interpretations. Just
stating your position is not enough. In particular,
1. Where does the OT say or infer that "earth" is spherical, a globe?
2. Where is your evidence that although the surrounding cultures understood
the earth to be floating on the tehom, Moses had a modern view of the ocean
and understood it as you interpret: as the ocean embedded in a spherical
3. Where does the OT say or infer that the fountains of the Deep (Gen 7:11)
were opened not at the surface of the earth, but at the bottom of the ocean?
4. Where does the OT say or infer that the Flood was caused by meteorites or
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