Re: Coral Growth Rates

Ed Brayton (
Thu, 27 May 1999 00:06:47 -0400

Dick Fischer wrote:

> Ed wrote:
> >Wow, Dick. This is brutal and, in my opinion, unfair. I am neither a
> Christian
> >nor a creationist, but I have had a few exchanges with Art Chadwick both
> on this
> >list and in private. He may be wrong, and I think he is, but to accuse him of
> >lack of respectability, dishonesty and indecency is way off base. Art has
> himself
> >debunked poor arguments made by his fellow YECs and he deals with the
> evidence
> >about as honestly as any YEC I have ever known. I think the vitriol you have
> >aimed at him is shameful and I think you owe him an apology for it.
> Dear Ed,
> Why do you speak as a non-Christian?

What a bizarre question. Are non-Christians not allowed to speak?

> Let's really get our priorities
> right. Art and I can carry this argument into eternity. Yes I'm angry.
> If we Christians were united in a defensible method of apology we might be
> able to persuade one such as you to join our ranks and become committed to
> Christ. You could take an eternity to thank us if you liked. But no, we
> argue and bicker and leave the way open for you and millions like you to
> shun our faith.

Frankly, Dick, arguing and bickering don't bother me a bit. An irresponsible
attack such as the one you made does bother me, but I am reasonable enough not to
attribute such an attack to Christianity. The behavior of Christians has nothing
to do with whether Christianity is true or not. It does, however, have some
bearing on whether we take any individual seriously or not, and after your attack
on the integrity of Art, who in my experience does not deserve it, I am far less
likely to take your views seriously.

> Ed, simply put, YEC is an evil deception. Mascarading as conservative
> Christian doctrine, its proponents tout a version of earth history that is
> tragically laughable. And by their blatant ignorance they make our faith
> in Christ laughable to those who are versed in matters of geology,
> astrophysics, anthropology, and the like. We have Christian universities,
> seminaries, and curriculums for homeschoolers carefully designed to crank
> out little Charley McCarthys and Mortimer Snerds that can't be taken
> seriously in matters of science, or by implication, matters of faith. And
> it's the faith that suffers - my faith, Ed. My Christian faith.

I think that YEC is wrong. I think that some YECs are terribly dishonest and I
would agree that YECism tends to push the scientifically literate away from
Christianity. But none of that justifies your personal attack on Art, who is, in
my opinion, a gentleman and a scholar even though I believe he is wrong. Guilt by
association went out with Joseph McCarthy, Dick.

> Art teaches at such a place. He teaches a sanitized science made compliant
> with their six-day creationism. In case some of the students have
> difficulties with reconciling discrepancies between YEC and the real world,
> they are so fortunate to have a real geologist on staff who can keep them
> in blissful ignorance. And if my retort is gruff, well, so be it. But if
> there is to be an apology, let us apologize to you. If we have caused you
> to reject the free gift of salvation because of whatever we may have said,
> then our words are grievious indeed.
> If an apology could bring one such as you to give his life for Christ, I'd
> apologize to a thousand Arts, nay a million, tens of millions. There is
> nothing nearly so important in the words we put here that can in anyway
> compare with one life saved. Your life, Ed.

As I said, your behavior has no bearing on the credibility of Christianity. The
fact that you would follow up such a nasty attack by trying to witness to me does,
however, have bearing on your credibility. I think you could take a lesson from my
friend (and I presume yours) Glenn Morton. He also attacks YEC from the
perspective of Christainity, but he generally sticks to critiquing the evidence. I
know damn well he would never launch so savage a personal attack on a man like Art
Chadwick. It seems you are unable to disagree with someone without demonizing them
personally. How sad.

Ed Brayton