RE: What does ID mean?

Bill Hamilton (
Tue, 21 Apr 1998 16:16:11 -0400

Dan Berger quoted me:

><snip> So far as I know, no natural law was violated. Nevertheless, I would
>> call this a miracle.
>> Of course I'm not ruling out God setting aside natural laws -- or utilizing
>> capabilities in nature that are unknown to us. But "miracle" does not have
>> to imply the violation of a law of nature.
Then he wrote

>All very true, Bill. But how does this help the ID case?

I don't see that it does. Nor was it my intention to help it. My point was
that people who are familiar with the methods of investigation of a given
field are more likely to to look for natural causes when investigating
phenomena -- even puzzling phenomena (oh heck, especially puzzling
phenomena. Any scientist ought to like a good challenge) in their field.
Those who aren't are more prone to being convinced that a supernatural
intervention has occurred.

Miracles which do
>not violate "laws" of nature are forever undetectable to those who refuse to
>see God's action. As I've stated before, there will always be some
possible --
>even plausible -- explanation which excludes God.


In the story you told (about
>cattle and the Dallas Theological Seminary), "coincidence" would be the
>skeptical response, especially given that not all prayers are answered in
>affirmative. To us, that's just evidence that God is not tame, and
>says "no."

>I don't think ID has a future in science because, as the Lord said, "If they
>will not believe Moses and the prophets, they would not believe even if
>were to return from the dead."


There's *always* a naturalistic explanation,
>and its plausibility will definitely be in the beholder's eye. "If miracles
>are excluded as intrinsically improbable, no evidence for a miracle will be
>accepted." (C.S. Lewis, _Miracles_, Chapter 1)

Did he say "improbable"? I thought he admitted something like the normal
colloquial meaning, namely that miracles are events one would normally
expect not to occur. IOW improbable events. Oh, he also says "excluded".
Okay. "Miracles"is a great book to read. I read it a few months ago, and
it seems I'd better go read it again.

Bill Hamilton, Staff Research Engineer
Chassis and Vehicle Systems, GM R&D Center
Warren, MI / (home)