Re: Science and Faith

Dick Fischer (
Sat, 20 Apr 1996 11:55:43 -0500

>To: (Glenn Morton)
>From: Dick Fischer <>
>Subject: Re: Science and Faith
>At 07:34 PM 4/19/96, you wrote:
>>But one observation I have made of Christian apologists is
>>that in general they don't want to be very specific and
>>risk verification or refutation. In fact we run from
>>verification and prediction like chickens in a barnyard run
>>from a hungry dog. The YEC's say that all the data of
>>science is wrong because the scientists have a big bias
>>and are not to be trusted. Thus they don't have to face
>>the facts.
>>Ramm who is somewhat of a centrist goes out of his way to
>>point out that it is unlikely that evidence for his flood
>>will be found. Verification is avoided.
>Glenn, let me just add that in fairness to Ramm much of the
>information that poured out of the Near Eastern archeological
>digs came after 1954 when his book was published. One of the
>classics is James Pritcherd's _Ancient Near Eastern Texts
>Relating to the Old Testament_. It came out in 1955. I found
>this one book invaluable, and it was the primary source I used
>for evidence of a local flood in the Mesopotamian basin.
>True enough, Albert Clay's _A Hebrew Deluge Story in Cuneiform_
>was published in 1922. But Ramm lived in California. I live
>within walking distance of the Orange Line Metro that stops
>about 4 blocks from the Library of Congress in Washington, DC.
>That facility has nearly every book that ever was published
>about this particular subject.
>Had Ramm chosen to live on the right coast instead of the left
>coast he might have been similarly blessed. He certainly would
>not have written, "Some sort of geological phenomenon is
>indicated by the expression 'and the fountains of the deep
>were broken up.'"
>This phrase "fountain (or fountains) of the deep" is used four
>times in Atrahasis. "Fountain" and "deep" are found elsewhere
>in Sumerian literature though not necessarily in conjunction.
>The "deep" was any body of water such as the Euphrates river. And
>"fountain" always pertains to their irrigation equipment. Here is
>a quote from Atrahasis, a parallel flood account, written in an
>ancient Semitic language. Preceding the great flood in Atrahasis
>there was a prolonged period of drought:
> "Below the fountain of the deep was stopped, that the
> flood rose not at the source.
> The field diminished its fertility."
>Also, the water-laid clay layers at the excavated city sites found
>only those elements that could be expected from the waters of the
>Euphrates. No remains of any salt water creatures were present
>which indicates none of the floods in that region involved sea water.
>This is no criticism of Ramm. But there are physical limits as to
>how much research you can do, finding what is available, and
>determining what is relevant.
>One other aside. The word "mist" in the phrase, "But there went up
>a mist from the earth to water the whole face of the ground"
>Gen. 2:6), in the Septuagint text is also the word "fountain."
>So Glenn's statement that Ramm "will always be right" was, well,
>wrong. The great body of literature on the parallel accounts and
>the archaeological analyses was published within twenty years
>of Ramm's book, available for all to read IF you come to the
>Library of Congress. Aye, there's the rub.
>Dick Fischer
* *
* *
* An Answer in the Creation - Evolution Debate *
* *
* Web page - *
* *